Christian-Forum.net > The 6-based Alpha-numeric Revelation

DaDad

Feb 10 2008, 09:29 PM

QUOTE(Godsword @ Feb 10 2008, 06:14 PM) [snapback]148781[/snapback]

QUOTE(DaDad @ Feb 10 2008, 05:51 PM) [snapback]148777[/snapback]

QUOTE(Godsword @ Feb 10 2008, 02:05 PM) [snapback]148746[/snapback]

Hi DaDad,
No, I am NOT Sicilian...

Are you having difficulty addressing my refutations of your claims?
Godsword

Hi Godsword,
#4. This question is based upon the "un-holy trinity" scenario which you apparently anticipate: Does your proposed A/C candidate have two other attributes, such that all three entities have a "666" association?
DaDad

I will take that as a "Yes":

QUOTE

I'm still not clear what you would consider "other attributes, such that all three entities have a '666' association". On the other hand, you yourself have yet to "play" the riddle game I gave. Perhaps I should wait until you do so, and then I could answer your questions more correctly and appropriately.

Silly Sicilians...

Godsword

Feb 10 2008, 09:55 PM

DaDad,

QUOTE

Silly Sicilians...

Perhaps. But maybe you'd like to try your "riddling" hand at my riddle. What could it hurt? And, it might be fun. (Or not.)

Orates

Feb 12 2008, 05:14 PM

I would like to add two more points to this debate.

Point 1- Any system of alpha-numerics used to calculate the name of the Antichrist has to have a high enough base to add to 666. The 1-3 base systems would not calculate high enough to include a name unless it was a exceeding long one. The 4-8 based systems would make it high enough, and anything higher would be too large.

Point 2- In order to come out to 666 evenly, the totals of the bases would have to be able to add up to 666, thus 5 base and 7 base would not work. 4 base and 8 base does not go evenly into 666 either. Logically then, to cover both points the 6 based system would fit just right.

Therefore mathematically, only the 2 base, 3 base, 6 base, 111 base, 222 base, 333 base, and 666 base systems could possibly add up to 666 using any combination of alpha-numeric values.

O

Godsword

Feb 13 2008, 12:16 AM

Orates,

QUOTE

Point 1- Any system of alpha-numerics used to calculate the name of the Antichrist has to have a high enough base to add to 666. The 1-3 base systems would not calculate high enough to include a name unless it was an exceeding long one.

Agreed. But some people have up to 10 names. For example: King Juan Carlos of Spain's full name is "Juan Carlos Alfonso Victor Maria de Borbon y Borbon". That's 43 letters right there - if one included his title, "King of Spain", that would be a total of 54 letters. If the alpha-numeric system for English was "1-based", then one could consider the average value of a letter to be about 13. Then, 54 x 13 = 702, which is obviously sufficient to add to 666. Clearly, very, very few people would have their names add to 666 in English using a "1-based" system, but it is certainly possible. For the "2-based" system, there would be quite a few more people whose names might qualify. And so on. So, really, not even the "1-based" system can be absolutely excluded. Even being very conservative, at the least one shouldn't exclude the possibility of using the "2-based" system out of hand.

QUOTE

The 4-8 based systems would make it high enough, and anything higher would be too large.

Sounds reasonable, but it would still be possible to have a "9-based" system, if a person's name was short, and used almost exclusively or exclusively only the first few letters (a through f, let's say, which isn't very likely, but would be possible). But let's grant that a "9-based" system should be excluded as not possible. This leaves the 2-8 based systems as the only possibilities (assuming for the moment that one should even use a system having any such base [there are other bases - actually, bases which have more history, and more language support than any of these "k-based" systems]).

QUOTE

Point 2- In order to come out to 666 evenly, the totals of the bases would have to be able to add up to 666, thus 5 base and 7 base would not work.

Correct. I hadn't noticed that before. But likewise in a "6-based" system, one could never arrive at a name which added to, say, 777 or 555, and in a "7-based" system, one could never arrive at a name which added to, say, 666 or 222 or 888, etc.. So really, one's choice of base influences one's results tremendously, which suggests that the characteristic of a particular name might not reflect in whatever number it calculates to, using such "bases".

QUOTE

4 base and 8 base does not go evenly into 666 either. Logically then, to cover both points the 6 based system would fit just right.

That's correct. But any name or word which adds to 666 in the "6-based" system ALSO adds to 555 in a "5-based" system, and to 777 in a "7-based" system, and in fact to kkk (not a reference to the Ku Klux Klan, by the way) in any "k-based" system. So, how one would want to interpret the "characteristic" of a name or word, based on what it calculates to, would depend on what base one used. In the "7-based" system, "computer" adds to 777. Does that mean computers are holy?

QUOTE

Therefore, mathematically, only the 2 base, 3 base, 6 base, 111 base, 222 base, 333 base, and 666 base systems could possibly add up to 666 using any combination of alpha-numeric values.

Although the "1-based" system would also work, though admittedly it would be very difficult for a person's name to add to 666 using this system. (But not impossible, as I have shown).

However, there is another, more ancient and more widely used, and more Biblically-supported, numeric system than any of these "k-based" systems - one which has several solid pieces of evidence suggesting it is to be used to calculate the Antichrist's name to 666. I suggest that for any alpha-numeric system to be justifiably considered the one to use to calculate the name of the Antichrist to 666, it should be "powerful" enough, or "flexible" enough, to result in ANY value, whether the result is 666 or 777 or 555, or even a prime number. NONE of the "k-based" systems (except the "1-based" system, which as we've seen is very unlikely, given how many letters would be needed in a name for the name to add to 666) fits this criterion. Does anyone here (other than me) know what the numeric system is that fits that criterion, and which has been relatively widely, and for ages, used?

Orates

Feb 16 2008, 05:43 PM

You are correct. I forgot to include the 1 base system as a mathematically possible base which could add to 666, given an exceeding long name or title. I also agree that the average name length is a better indicator of the Antichrist's name possiblility. I don't think anyone knows the answer to your last question- please fill us in...

O

Godsword

Feb 16 2008, 05:55 PM

Orates,

QUOTE

You are correct. I forgot to include the 1 base system as a mathematically possible base which could add to 666, given an exceeding long name or title. I also agree that the average name length is a better indicator of the Antichrist's name possibility. I don't think anyone knows the answer to your last question- please fill us in....

I'll quote my last question, along with its "prefatory" context:

QUOTE

However, there is another, more ancient and more widely used, and more Biblically-supported, numeric system than any of these "k-based" systems - one which has several solid pieces of evidence suggesting it is to be used to calculate the Antichrist's name to 666. I suggest that for any alpha-numeric system to be justifiably considered the one to use to calculate the name of the Antichrist to 666, it should be "powerful" enough, or "flexible" enough, to result in ANY value, whether the result is 666 or 777 or 555, or even a prime number. NONE of the "k-based" systems (except the "1-based" system, which as we've seen is very unlikely, given how many letters would be needed in a name for the name to add to 666) fits this criterion. Does anyone here (other than me) know what the numeric system is that fits that criterion, and which has been relatively widely, and for ages, used?

Since you ask, and ask politely, I'll answer. You can find the numeric system I refer to in the first column of the "table" I posted in my original post in the thread, "The Numbers 456, 666, and 777", in this very discussion area, Bible Numbers. The numeric system is the numbering system used with the Hebrew and Greek alphabets, and is one which those two languages have used for centuries to represent numbers. It was also the numbering system in use with the Greek alphabet at the time that John wrote the Book of Revelation, and mentioned calculating the Antichrist's name to 666.

[Edited to add: Huh...I just noticed I posted that at exactly 5:55 p.m.. Interesting.

]

Godsword

Feb 20 2008, 01:42 PM

Well, what think you, Orates?

sacred hand

Feb 21 2008, 11:08 PM

Good work in compiling an overview of alpha numerics! It never stops amazing me that students of Scripture are not very interested in the subject of the mark of the beast and various ways that it might be calculated. Especially since it seems to be an admonishment to calculate it!!!

I have an extensive printable word list on my blogspot of over a couple hundred words that add up to 666 using the basic system A=6, B=12, C=18,... I have never seen a list anywhere of this length and have added to it over a 20 year period. "Santa Claus", "commercials" ,and "vaccination" were the 3 that greatly affected the way I felt as a young Christian parent many years ago. Many words display the seriousness of the code and deserve consideration, some are peculiar, on the revelation it pertains to.

I continue to study all mathematics and geometry as it pertains to scripture and I feel part of a small community of those who have "eyes to see" on this subject, trying to put information out that hopefully pertains to the coming of the kingdom! I just e-published a very unique view of the lineage of Adam, called the "Patriarch Lineage Table" which focuses on the "place holding values" , hidden in the linear story line.
Sincerely, Karen

Devoted to Grace

Godsword

Feb 22 2008, 10:13 AM

Orates, any thoughts?

Orates

Feb 22 2008, 03:12 PM

QUOTE(Godsword @ Feb 22 2008, 10:13 AM) [snapback]153122[/snapback]

Orates, any thoughts?

I have not had access to a computer for awhile. I still believe that John was giving us a prophectic code that would pertain to people in the end times to calculate the name of the Antichrist. Not too many people know ancient Greek or Latin today, so English would be a perfect prophectic language that would most likely lead to a discovery of the name through this code system today.

O

Godsword

Feb 22 2008, 07:16 PM

Orates,

QUOTE

I have not had access to a computer for awhile.

Sorry to hear that.

QUOTE

I still believe that John was giving us a prophetic code that would pertain to people in the end times to calculate the name of the Antichrist.

I absolutely agree.

QUOTE

Not too many people know ancient Greek or Latin today, so English would be a perfect prophetic language that would most likely lead to a discovery of the name through this code system today.

Actually, it's more likely the "calculating" would be done in Greek and/or Hebrew (rather than Greek or Latin). And, there should be some unique identifying characteristic which would point to the particular language, and the particular numbering system, to use, in my opinion. The "6-based alpha-numeric" system is not "unique" (more than one "k-based alpha-numeric" system could qualify), and whatever combination of letters adds to 666 in that system will add to 777 in the "7-based alpha-numeric" system, so that it is not "unique" in the sense of "identifying" a particular number with a particular combination of letters. Furthermore, the "6-based alpha-numeric" system is not "powerful enough" to allow effectively ANY number to be the result: by its nature, it does not allow multitudes of numbers from resulting, such as any prime number, any number which is a factor of 5 but is not divisible by 6, etc.. And, not that many people today know the various numbering systems, nor the reasoning behind them; nor do many people today know much about Bible prophecy. But none of that should have any real bearing on what system to use to calculate the number of the Antichrist's name, because God says it will take "wisdom" to do so, in any case. Certainly, it would take more "wisdom" to calculate the Antichrist's name to 666 if the system used the Greek or Hebrew alphabets; also, God chose to have the Bible written originally in Hebrew and Greek, in particular having the Book of Revelation originally written in Greek - I should think that those two languages and alphabets would therefore be the most likely languages and alphabets to use to calculate the Antichrist's name to 666.

None of these "failings" hold for the Hebrew/Greek numbering system, however. Have you had a chance to look over the thread in Bible Numbers titled, "The Numbers 456, 666, and 777"? If and when you do have a chance to do so, and you elect to do so, I'd be curious to know what you think of the information in the original post in that thread.

DaDad

Feb 22 2008, 09:19 PM

QUOTE(Orates @ Feb 22 2008, 03:12 PM) [snapback]153295[/snapback]

... I still believe that John was giving us a prophectic code that would pertain to people in the end times to calculate the name of the Antichrist. Not too many people know ancient Greek or Latin today, so English would be a perfect prophectic language that would most likely lead to a discovery of the name through this code system today.
O

Hi Orates,
I can't recall if this has been posted already, and it may seem a little obvious, but English IS the world's language. It's the language of industry, technology, commercialism, commerce, etc. However, what's probably not known by some, is that for international air travel, the aircraft pilots and air-traffic controllers use an agreed upon common language.

You guessed it. -- English!

And if I'm not mistaken, scripture only says "let him who has wisdom". I don't believe this infers an indepth grasp of obscure languages, using tera-flop computers, and statistical techniques.
With Best Regards,
DaDad

Godsword

Feb 22 2008, 09:55 PM

DaDad,

QUOTE

And if I'm not mistaken, scripture only says "let him who has wisdom". I don't believe this infers an indepth grasp of obscure languages, using tera-flop computers, and statistical techniques.

"Implies". I believe you meant "implies". In any case, the "wisdom" mentioned in Revelation 13:18 would seemingly require a bit more "in-depth-ness" than merely knowing the English language, and how to add factors of 6 - else, it wouldn't require "wisdom", particularly. I should think there would be something involved which would require a bit of insight that most would not have, or would not immediately see. And this would be another reason to think the system would not be the "6-based alpha-numeric" system. The "wisdom" mentioned would likely require being able to discern "clues" that God has put in place, clues which would not be readily obvious to all, but which would be clear once seen. Those clues, in order to actually be clues, would also require greater specificity, and less contradictory evidence, than what the "6-based alpha-numeric" system offers.

Also, I note that you have yet to answer my question regarding the thread, "The Numbers 456, 666, and 777". Which reminds me that, unlike myself in relation to your "riddle"-game, you never took part in my proferred "riddle"-game. I had to give you the answer, and even then you have not made any comment, yea or nay, about the information I provided. Ah well, I suppose I should have expected as much.

And as far as the languages are concerned: I repeat my point that of English, Greek, and Hebrew, only Greek and Hebrew were used by God to write down the original Scriptures; and in particular I note that Revelation 13:18 was originally written in the Greek language. Unless we know that we are now living in the Last Days (which I believe we are, but that's a secondary point), we cannot know if English will be that "universal" language which some assume will be necessary to effect the calculating of the Antichrist's name to 666. If Jesus' return is not for another, say, 500 years, perhaps the "universal" language will be by that time Spanish, which would render the "evidence" supposedly found in English using the "6-based alpha-numeric" system moot. Thus, that "evidence" is very weak, and dependent on the times.

In contrast, there happen to be at least four "timeless" pieces of evidence which point to God's having intended the Hebrew/Greek numbering system, combined with either the Hebrew or Greek (or both) language, to be used to calculate the Antichrist's name to 666. One is the fact that the Bible was originally written in Hebrew and Greek (and this fact does not change with time); another is that Revelation 13:18 itself was written in Greek (and this fact, as well, does not change with time); another is that Hebrew and Greek used the Hebrew/Greek numbering system to represent numbers (a fact which does not change with time, and which happens to not be true for the English language, in that English has NEVER used its alphabet as a numerical system); and finally is a direct, unique, and clear correspondence which is "built-into" that numbering system between the numbers 666 and 777 and the number 456, which number happens to be the number of the "anti-Antichrist" using that numbering system with the letters of the Greek alphabet which were used as letters in writing the New Testament (and this correspondence likewise does not change with time).

Care to guess what the "anti-Antichrist"'s name is?

DaDad

Feb 23 2008, 04:13 PM

QUOTE (Godsword @ Feb 22 2008, 09:55 PM)

DaDad,
Care to guess what the "anti-Antichrist"'s name is?

Hi Godsword,
Silly Sicilian.

With Best Regards,
DaDad

Orates

Feb 23 2008, 05:44 PM

QUOTE (Godsword @ Feb 22 2008, 09:55 PM)

DaDad,

QUOTE

And if I'm not mistaken, scripture only says "let him who has wisdom". I don't believe this infers an indepth grasp of obscure languages, using tera-flop computers, and statistical techniques.

"Implies". I believe you meant "implies". In any case, the "wisdom" mentioned in Revelation 13:18 would seemingly require a bit more "in-depth-ness" than merely knowing the English language, and how to add factors of 6 - else, it wouldn't require "wisdom", particularly. I should think there would be something involved which would require a bit of insight that most would not have, or would not immediately see. And this would be another reason to think the system would not be the "6-based alpha-numeric" system. The "wisdom" mentioned would likely require being able to discern "clues" that God has put in place, clues which would not be readily obvious to all, but which would be clear once seen. Those clues, in order to actually be clues, would also require greater specificity, and less contradictory evidence, than what the "6-based alpha-numeric" system offers.

Also, I note that you have yet to answer my question regarding the thread, "The Numbers 456, 666, and 777". Which reminds me that, unlike myself in relation to your "riddle"-game, you never took part in my proferred "riddle"-game. I had to give you the answer, and even then you have not made any comment, yea or nay, about the information I provided. Ah well, I suppose I should have expected as much.

And as far as the languages are concerned: I repeat my point that of English, Greek, and Hebrew, only Greek and Hebrew were used by God to write down the original Scriptures; and in particular I note that Revelation 13:18 was originally written in the Greek language. Unless we know that we are now living in the Last Days (which I believe we are, but that's a secondary point), we cannot know if English will be that "universal" language which some assume will be necessary to effect the calculating of the Antichrist's name to 666. If Jesus' return is not for another, say, 500 years, perhaps the "universal" language will be by that time Spanish, which would render the "evidence" supposedly found in English using the "6-based alpha-numeric" system moot. Thus, that "evidence" is very weak, and dependent on the times.

In contrast, there happen to be at least four "timeless" pieces of evidence which point to God's having intended the Hebrew/Greek numbering system, combined with either the Hebrew or Greek (or both) language, to be used to calculate the Antichrist's name to 666. One is the fact that the Bible was originally written in Hebrew and Greek (and this fact does not change with time); another is that Revelation 13:18 itself was written in Greek (and this fact, as well, does not change with time); another is that Hebrew and Greek used the Hebrew/Greek numbering system to represent numbers (a fact which does not change with time, and which happens to not be true for the English language, in that English has NEVER used its alphabet as a numerical system); and finally is a direct, unique, and clear correspondence which is "built-into" that numbering system between the numbers 666 and 777 and the number 456, which number happens to be the number of the "anti-Antichrist" using that numbering system with the letters of the Greek alphabet which were used as letters in writing the New Testament (and this correspondence likewise does not change with time).

Care to guess what the "anti-Antichrist"'s name is?

I am repeating my response from your previous post here. Please include your candidate for the Anti-christ using your system.

Your agruments and evidence of a Bible code using Hebrew and Greek are good ones (English is the newcomer I admit). If God is behind the revelations these codes reveal, then it makes sense that there may be multi-level and multi-language codes that do reveal some interesting relationships. But, do you realize that all God needed was for one name to add to 666 in any system to fulfill the prophecy? Which one to use would be based on some supporting evidence that would point the way. 6 based alpha-numerics has numerous amazing connections, as do other systems. I do believe that God wants us to know the identify of the Anti-christ when he comes on the scene. We will at that time see the fulfillment of prophectic events pointing to a particular person in history. A code will be used to back up the prophecies. Maybe it is not meant to know the exact system to be used until the actual time of revealing. Right now the only name of consequence using the 6 based system of a candidate for the Anti-christ, who is both Jewish, a peace negotiator, and has mucho political cloat, is Kissinger (last name only used). If anyone has calculated another famous living person who may gualify please include here.
O

Godsword

Feb 23 2008, 05:58 PM

QUOTE (DaDad @ Feb 23 2008, 04:13 PM)

QUOTE (Godsword @ Feb 22 2008, 09:55 PM)

DaDad,
Care to guess what the "anti-Antichrist"'s name is?

Hi Godsword,
Silly Sicilian.

With Best Regards,
DaDad

Well, it seems that you prefer to end our conversations, without having to address my points and questions. That is fine, as I have found that attempts to get answers from you, and to engage in genuine conversation with you, are rather difficult and irritating. As it is, given your above reply, and my prior (civil) warning to you regarding such replies, and given how highly I value my word, our conversations are now at an end. I have found them, at best, frustrating. (And that is not a compliment in any sense, by the way.) Enjoy your condescending riddles and games. I will post comments as I choose, but will not directly respond to you again. I might forgive you, but I will not directly respond to you here again.

Orates

Mar 25 2008, 01:22 PM

QUOTE (DaDad @ Feb 22 2008, 09:19 PM)

QUOTE (Orates @ Feb 22 2008, 03:12 PM)

... I still believe that John was giving us a prophectic code that would pertain to people in the end times to calculate the name of the Antichrist. Not too many people know ancient Greek or Latin today, so English would be a perfect prophectic language that would most likely lead to a discovery of the name through this code system today.
O

Hi Orates,
I can't recall if this has been posted already, and it may seem a little obvious, but English IS the world's language. It's the language of industry, technology, commercialism, commerce, etc. However, what's probably not known by some, is that for international air travel, the aircraft pilots and air-traffic controllers use an agreed upon common language.

You guessed it. -- English!

And if I'm not mistaken, scripture only says "let him who has wisdom". I don't believe this infers an indepth grasp of obscure languages, using tera-flop computers, and statistical techniques.
With Best Regards,
DaDad

Have you ever wondered why the name "Jesus", that we use in English, has such power? If His name was different in each language then the power would be watered down. That is why I believe we will be referring to His English name (derived from Hebrew, Greek, and Latin) in Heaven.

O

DaDad

Mar 26 2008, 08:32 PM

QUOTE (Orates @ Mar 25 2008, 02:22 PM)

QUOTE (DaDad @ Feb 22 2008, 09:19 PM)

QUOTE (Orates @ Feb 22 2008, 03:12 PM)

... I still believe that John was giving us a prophectic code that would pertain to people in the end times to calculate the name of the Antichrist. Not too many people know ancient Greek or Latin today, so English would be a perfect prophectic language that would most likely lead to a discovery of the name through this code system today.
O

Hi Orates,
I can't recall if this has been posted already, and it may seem a little obvious, but English IS the world's language. It's the language of industry, technology, commercialism, commerce, etc. However, what's probably not known by some, is that for international air travel, the aircraft pilots and air-traffic controllers use an agreed upon common language.

You guessed it. -- English!

And if I'm not mistaken, scripture only says "let him who has wisdom". I don't believe this implies an indepth grasp of obscure languages, using tera-flop computers, and statistical techniques.
With Best Regards,
DaDad

Have you ever wondered why the name "Jesus", that we use in English, has such power? If His name was different in each language then the power would be watered down. That is why I believe we will be referring to His English name (derived from Hebrew, Greek, and Latin) in Heaven.

O

Hi Orates,
Clearly most people presume that "JESUS" was the name used 2,000 years ago, as spoken by his family, friends, followers, and ultimately burial detail. Even today, many product or technologically based "names" are carried cross-language, such as Coke, croissant, baseball, computer, etc., as opposed to those words which are unique in each culture typical of kitchen/cochina, cheese/queso, etc.

In what you suggest, what would that name have been in Hebrew, Greek, Aramaic, Latin, and/or other modern languages?

Even so, I would fully anticipate that anyone who called on the Messiah, even using a descriptive reference such as "We adjure you by Jesus whom Paul preacheth", in any language, would have that immediate and full authority just exactly as having said "Jesus".

Don't you think?

With Best Regards,
DaDad

Orates

Apr 23 2008, 06:32 PM

Have you ever wondered why the name "Jesus", that we use in English, has such power? If His name was different in each language then the power would be watered down. That is why I believe we will be referring to His English name (derived from Hebrew, Greek, and Latin) in Heaven.

Hi Orates,
Clearly most people presume that "JESUS" was the name used 2,000 years ago, as spoken by his family, friends, followers, and ultimately burial detail. Even today, many product or technologically based "names" are carried cross-language, such as Coke, croissant, baseball, computer, etc., as opposed to those words which are unique in each culture typical of kitchen/cochina, cheese/queso, etc.

In what you suggest, what would that name have been in Hebrew, Greek, Aramaic, Latin, and/or other modern languages?

Even so, I would fully anticipate that anyone who called on the Messiah, even using a descriptive reference such as "We adjure you by Jesus whom Paul preacheth", in any language, would have that immediate and full authority just exactly as having said "Jesus".

Don't you think?

With Best Regards,
DaDad

I meant to say in the top post that the English version of Jesus' name has power to cast out demons, heal the sick, save one's soul. I was wrong to say that that power is lessoned by using a different version of His name in other languages. Jesus was born Yeshua in Aramaic. I do not know which name He will use in Heaven- maybe a different name for each language...

Here is a history of His name from http://www.hadavar.net/nameofjesus.html

The name Jesus is an anglicized form of the Latin Iesus, which itself is derived from the Greek name Iesous. Iesous was the Greek transliteration of the Aramaic name Yeshua, which itself was the later Aramaic form of the Hebrew name Yehoshua.[1]

BIBLICAL USAGE

We can follow the development of this name by looking at references to Joshua the son of Nun, the successor to Moses. Joshua was originally named Hoshea (Num. 13:16), but Moses changed it to Yehoshua (YHWH is salvation[2]) which has the Divine Name attached as a prefix. Yehoshua was the common name for Joshua, but in later Biblical times the name was shortened to the form Yeshua. This is evidenced in Nehemiah 8:17 where, in reference to Joshua, the Hebrew text[3] reads Yeshua in place of Yehoshua. The Septuagint[4], an ancient Greek translation of the Hebrew Scriptures, renders Joshua’s name as Iesous in the Nehemiah passage as well as throughout the book of Joshua. In transliterating to Greek, there is no “sh” sound, and this kind of noun requires an “–s” ending. Iesous was the result. In the New Testament there are two references to Joshua, Acts 7:45 and Hebrews 4:8. In both of these places the Greek[5] uses the form Iesous, which most translations render as Joshua. The King James Version, however, mistakenly translates it as Jesus in both cases. But in all other cases it does refer to Jesus[6].

POST-BIBLICAL USAGE

As Christianity spread from the Middle East into Europe, Latin became the dominant language. Messiah’s Greek name was transliterated as Iesu, Ihesu or Iesus but pronounced the same as the Greek form. The letter “j” was a later development in the English language, not appearing in use until the Middle Ages[7]. Eventually his name was written in this manner, first as Jesu, then later as Jesus.

SUMMARY

Jesus grew up and lived in a cultural crossroad and multilingual society. He most certainly knew Hebrew, since it was the written language of Scripture and was used in synagogue and temple services. He also spoke Aramaic, since the New Testament gives examples of its use.[8] He probably spoke Greek as well, though we don’t know to what extent. Among Hebrew and Aramaic-speaking people, including his mother and those at home, he was called Yeshua. Among Greek-speaking people he was called Iesous. In today’s Messianic and Hebrew roots movements there is a call to return to the original name that Jesus grew up with (Yeshua), while some Sacred Name groups argue that His name was really Yahshua[9]. But neither the Jewish translators of the Septuagint nor the writers of the New Testament saw fit to record Joshua’s name any other way but Iesous. If they wanted to show the Divine Name (Yah) they could have written Iasous (IasouV). But they did this for neither Joshua nor Jesus. Referring to Jesus today as Yeshua is perfectly acceptable, especially in Jewish culture, but it is not mandated. On the contrary, the Scriptures are full of examples of people who went by more than one name or had both Hebrew and foreign names[10]. Today we shorten names, accept nicknames, and use aliases. The Biblical pattern seems to be acceptance of name changes and variations. In other words, they were just like us. A fitting name, Yeshua means “salvation”[11] for “he will save his people from their sins” (Matt. 1:21) and is referred to in the New Testament as “the name that is above every name” (Philippians 4:3).

O

Minister D

Apr 23 2008, 11:57 PM

QUOTE (Orates @ Apr 7 2006, 07:36 AM)

6 Based Alpha Numeric Language Code

A secret Code exists in a language of man (English). Using the Code, you can convert words in English to an alpha-numeric value. Comparing words of like value reveals interesting relationships that have religious meaning.

The Code was hinted at by John in the book of Revelation in the Bible- Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is 666.

There could not have been any human intelligence that influenced these results because of the long time frame and the myriad of influences on the development of the English language.

It is God's secret code to spiritual truth.

The Code is in the form of a progression and is a multiple of 6.
Each line is added to give a letter a value.

A= 6/ 6
B=12/ 66
C=18/ 666
D=24/ 6666
E=30/ 66666
F=36/ 666666
G=42/ 6666666
H=48/ 66666666
I=54/ 666666666
J=60/ 6666666666
K=66/ 66666666666
L=72/ 666666666666
M=78/ 6666666666666
N=84/ 66666666666666
O=90/ 666666666666666
P=96/ 6666666666666666
Q=102/ 66666666666666666
R=108/ 666666666666666666
S=114/ 6666666666666666666
T=120/ 66666666666666666666
U=126/ 666666666666666666666
V=132/ 6666666666666666666666
W=138/ 66666666666666666666666
X=144/ 666666666666666666666666
Y=150/ 6666666666666666666666666
Z=156/ 66666666666666666666666666

The Number of Man

Throughout Jewish history man has been associated with the number 6, from the creation of man on the 6th day to the 6 pointed Star of David on Israel's flag. If we were to give the value of 6 to the letter A and add six to each letter in a progression, we would develop a code that can convert any English word into a value. If we compare words with similar values- an amazing relationship takes place.

Examples:
HELL=222, HADES=222
ISRAEL=384, ZION=384
JESUS CHRIST=906, HOLY SPIRIT=906
SATAN=330, BURN=330, JUDAS=330
EARTH=312, SALT=312

But sometimes there are groups of two or more words that are linked by their similar values and the chance that these links exist are astounding.

A to Z Alpha to Omega. Man is associated with the number 6 and the word God adds to 156 or our last letter of the alphabet Z. Jesus said I am the Alpha and Omega the Beginning and the End- Man and God.

Observe these amazing links:

Jesus=444, Joshua=444, Y'Shua=444, Messiah=444, GodSon=444, Cross-444, JHVH God=444, Great I Am=444, Gospel=444, Beauty=444, Energy=444, Bible Faith=444, Bible Hope=444

Virgin=474, Mother=474

Mother Mary=816, Virgin Birth=816

Eternal=450, Lord God=450, Lamb of God=450, Suffer=450

Golgotha=450, Crucify=450, Violence=450

Church=366, Miracle=366

Holy Church=726, Poverty=726

Jesus Christ=906, Baby Poverty=906

Redeemer=438, Crown=438, Kingdom=438, Anoint=438, Children=438, Patience=438, Sacrifice=438, Paradise=438, Alleluia=438.

Christian=462, Repentance=462, Holiness=462.

One of the more interesting links is related to John's 666 prophecy.

Mark of Beast=666, Witchcraft=666, Holy Rome=666, New York=666, Kissinger=666, Computer=666, Santa Claus=666, America Church=666, Laodicea Church=666, Love City=666, Crucify God=666.

I have compiled a few interesting links (see samples in the index). I can't calculate the odds of these words and phrases matching, but it must be astronomical. The true revelation of this code will come when someone writes a program that can automatically calculate every word in the dictionary, and then group the words together according to their values. Is this the hidden language Code that will reveal all? Some say that English is the universal language of mankind. It is comprised of many words from different languages and is taught by nearly every country- if they want to progress. I can't say if the code works the same way in other languages- it would be truly amazing if it did. But I think there is something here to ponder and it will take wisdom to decode the messages hidden within our own words.

Index

King of Jews=714 High, Priest=714, Redeemer=714

Abraham=264, Faith=264, Kill=264

Jerusalem=624, Idolatry=624

Elijah=270, Enoch=270

Divine=372, Deity=372, Whole=372

Priesthood=774, Scripture=774

Believer=468, Repent=468

Billy Graham=648, Evangelism=648, Worship=648

Faith=264, Zeal=264

Spiritual=750, Fellowship=750

Anointed=575, Forgiven=576

Creator=480, Logos=480

God=156, Heal=156

Emmanuel=504, Savior=504

Prayer=498, Wisdom=498

Bethlehem=498, Shepard=498

Zealot=474, Murder=474

False Prophet=846, Tribulation=846

Wrath=420, Fury=420

Wife=258, Give=258

Marriage=432, School=432, World=432

Happy=396. Family=396

Child=144, Kid=144

Children=438, Patience=438, Sacrifice=438

Divorce=456, Vengeance=456

Body=276, Milk=276

Sun=324, Health=324

Chemical=324, Beware=324

Science=348, Barren=348

Mother=474, Nature=474

Heart=312, Pride=312

Birth=342, Moon=342

Abortion=564, Innocent=564

Disease=372, Plague=372, Medicine=372

Homosexual=798, Temptation=798

War=252, Gun=252

Gold=Fire=Death=Decay=Noah=Ocean=228

Babylon=426, Money=426

Sport=528, Egotism=528, Good Time=528

Hero=Win=276

Dollar=372, Enemy=372

Alpha Numeric=726, Revelation=726
---------------------------------------------------------------
Orates 2006

DaDad

Apr 24 2008, 02:06 PM

QUOTE (Orates @ Apr 23 2008, 07:32 PM)

Have you ever wondered why the name "Jesus", that we use in English, has such power? If His name was different in each language then the power would be watered down. That is why I believe we will be referring to His English name (derived from Hebrew, Greek, and Latin) in Heaven.

Hi Orates,
Clearly most people presume that "JESUS" was the name used 2,000 years ago, as spoken by his family, friends, followers, and ultimately burial detail. Even today, many product or technologically based "names" are carried cross-language, such as Coke, croissant, baseball, computer, etc., as opposed to those words which are unique in each culture typical of kitchen/cochina, cheese/queso, etc.

In what you suggest, what would that name have been in Hebrew, Greek, Aramaic, Latin, and/or other modern languages?

Even so, I would fully anticipate that anyone who called on the Messiah, even using a descriptive reference such as "We adjure you by Jesus whom Paul preacheth", in any language, would have that immediate and full authority just exactly as having said "Jesus".

Don't you think?

With Best Regards,
DaDad

I meant to say in the top post that the English version of Jesus' name has power to cast out demons, heal the sick, save one's soul. I was wrong to say that that power is lessoned by using a different version of His name in other languages. Jesus was born Yeshua in Aramaic. I do not know which name He will use in Heaven- maybe a different name for each language...

Here is a history of His name from http://www.hadavar.net/nameofjesus.html

...
O

Hi Orates,
Thanks for the clarification. -- Full Agreement!
With Best Regards,
DaDad