Maybe I should take a poll of people who believe that they are part of the 144,000 choosen ones?

I'm very curious what qualifies one to be part of this group?

Are they.....super duper spiritual?

Are they completely sinless?

I don't know, perhaps they've memorized the Bible forwards and backwards??

Are they totally perfect in the flesh?

The bible plainly says that the 144000 come from every tribe of Israel, 12000 each. Twelve tribes times 12000 equals 144000. Not for the gentiles to worry about.

Rev 7:2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
Rev 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
Rev 7:4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: [and there were] sealed an hundred [and] forty [and] four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
Rev 7:5 Of the tribe of Juda [were] sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Reuben [were] sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Gad [were] sealed twelve thousand.
Rev 7:6 Of the tribe of Aser [were] sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Nepthalim [were] sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Manasses [were] sealed twelve thousand.
Rev 7:7 Of the tribe of Simeon [were] sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Levi [were] sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Issachar [were] sealed twelve thousand.
Rev 7:8 Of the tribe of Zabulon [were] sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Joseph [were] sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Benjamin [were] sealed twelve thousand.
Rev 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
Rev 7:10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.
Rev 7:11 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and [about] the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 7:12 Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, [be] unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.
Rev 7:13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
Rev 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
Rev 7:15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.
Rev 7:16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat.
Rev 7:17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

Rev 14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
Rev 14:2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
Rev 14:3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
Rev 14:4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
Rev 14:5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.

What a wonderful question Marta!

I hope I can try to help a little with the answer. You asked if these people were completly sinless. All I know for sure is this. There has been only one person who has ever walked the face of the earth who was sinless from birth to death and we all know Him or seek to know Him. So, we know that 1 does not equal 144,000, so that can't be it. These people couldn't have been sinless from birth to death.

So who then? Well I know this. If we follow Jesus, and claim His blood as our defense for our transgression of the law, we are forgiven. But being forgiven alone isn't going to work because the 144,000 were described as never having sinned. This IS a puzzle isn't it?

Wait, there is an answer! Have you ever heard the phrase "Forgive and Forget"? That's it! God promises us if we wash ourselves in the blood of the lamb the record of our transgression is blotted out!! He told us He would remember them no more!! Forgive and forget!! He can forget, I wonder if we can? Anyway, if we wash in the blood of the Lamb, our robes become as white as snow! There is no defect or deformity found in us. We are perfect in the sight of God. So that's how these 144,000 do it!

I think the trickiest part of this is that you must ask for forgiveness to be forgiven. If you want to be among the 144,000 you need to become an expert on sin. Not in it's practice, but in its nature and avoidance. You can unknowingly mess-up your perfect white robes, so I think we should try our very best to keep them clean by learning about all the ways they can get dirty in the first place!

You asked if they memorized the bible. I think you don't need to know everything, you just need to know where to get the information when you need it. The info is in the bible and no place else, so we're set there. Bible or nothing. Instead, listen to what people are saying to you then go to your bible and test it. If the bible screams out in objection to what they've said, then you know. If what they've said agrees with what your bible is saying, they speak the truth.

Use the bible as a test of truth. If you have to discern all truth from the bible, it's tough. I'd suggest that biblical scholars have been studying it for centuries and still miss obvious things.

What a wonderful question! I hope I helped. I love you all!

To answer the original question, "Do you qualify", nope. I ain't Jewish.

I don't qualify either! But I can't wait for that day when we do find out who they are, cuz we'll be with Jesus then!!!!

Not sure if I'm Jewish or not...but know for sure I am not one of the 144,000.....they will be Jews witnessing when we are in heaven. The Ball will be back in their court to spread the word of God... this time.....Praise the Lord.

But, in my family there has been talk that we "are" Jewish....the black Irish were either Jewish, Spanish or Italian.... People look at their pictures and ask if they are Jewish ....and My father's dark German side....looks like they were Jewish.

I might get a DNA test for the fun of it....and get it settled once and for all...I like the idea of being Jewish.....some of my German cousins may not be so thrilled as me.... they are what some call "high" German. But, I'm mostly Irish and Norweigian.... known in America as a mutt God Bless. marie

Rev 14:5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.

Mr David, you stated that "these people couldn't have been sinless from birth to death." I agree.

You then said ... "but being forgiven alone isn't going to work because the 144,000 were described as never having sinned ... "

Not exactly ... having never sinned is quite different from being without fault before the throne of God... "

I think you may agree.
calvin

You bet Calvin! You're right on there. God choses not to remember becuase He said He wouldn't, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. I think this is a wonderful message of hope for all of us that he would forgive and forget like that. I think that's what all of us need to try and do. I know I've been guilty of forgiving and not forgetting and it didn't turn out that well for me, until I realized what I did and fixed it. I had to ask forgiveness for not forgiving!!

Here's a question for everybody. Other than the righteous dead who arise from the earth when Jesus returns, and these 144,000, is there anybody else? Is there anybody who lives through the tribulation that makes it aside from the 144K?

In my heart I feel that the 144K is the total of all who live through the tribulation, but if they are all literal Jews, what about the rest of us then? I'm hoping it's either not literal but spiritual Jews or there's more than the 144k. Anyone with any thoughts on that they'd like to toss out?

The 144,000 are jewish innocents. the reminant of Isreal to be saved during the Day of the Lord.

Revelation 14

1 Then I looked, and behold, a Lamb standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His Father’s name written on their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven, like the voice of many waters, and like the voice of loud thunder. And I heard the sound of harpists playing their harps. 3 They sang as it were a new song before the throne, before the four living creatures, and the elders; and no one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who were redeemed from the earth. 4 These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb. 5 And in their mouth was found no deceit, for they are without fault before the throne of God.

Little ones are innocent.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Adstar,
you said...Little ones are innocent.

Do you mean babies or maybe young children? What a neat concept!

Rev 14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

I just noticed a suttle difference in translations.

What is Revelation actually about ?
It is about Jesus Second Coming , is it not ?

Its a promise from Jesus to the Church .

------
the 144,000.

They are walking with the Lamb , so I figure that this is the Millenial Kingdom revealed .

All sorts of things will happen in the millenial Kingdom .
Isaiah 11

I am a newbie, both in the group and in my walk with Christ. I am confused... I was raised in an Christian home but know more with my heart than my mind...
I have also known those who were jehovah witness and they think a total of 144,000 people are going to heaven, period. I thought that all are welcome in heaven, as long as you have been washed in the blood of the lamb and have professed your life to the lord. I hope I am not putting a wrench into the thread, but any guidance would be appreciated.

Nope--I'm not one. I believe you are called of God as was Aaron--as a prophet is called. Those who are, know they are. Those who aren't, like me, know they aren't.

I'm absolutely sure, though, that I will be here to see them. I'm thrilled to think that it's getting to be that time and that they are beginning to come forth, just like I can't wait for the two witnesses.

We hear enough of the a/c and the false prophet, and we know they are coming and a bunch of bad is coming, but I love to think about the good ones that are on their way and can't wait for them to get here! That means that the Second Coming and the millennium are that much closer!

Yes thats what i mean Roxygal Can you imagine the little ones singing for God.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Yes you are right it is one of the differences between the KJV and the NKJV. I prefer to use the KNJV because of its modern language but i believe the in the forehead of the KJV is a more accurate translation than the on the forehead in the NKJV. It’s a great pity that those who are staunch defenders of the KJV have not produced a modern and accurate translation of it.

Also if you look at the scriptures that refer to the mark of the beast you will find the same discrepancy.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

We will be with God in eternity. But just because the bible makes mention of a particular 144,000 Jew's does not mean that they are the only ones.

The poor Jehovah witnesses they currently have over 10,000,000 adherents world wide and throughout their history their must have been about 10 million more. But they claim that only 144,000 will go to heaven? That makes it around 1 in 20... and the odds are growing worse the more people they get into their "religion" of course the founders of that religion though that Jesus was going to return around the year 1914. back when they where few in number. Their teaching must becoming more and more uncomfortable to them.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Well I am going to give this link. Its the best I have ever read on the subject. In short...auditions for the 144000 closed a lit bit less than 2000 years ago. Its why they are called "first fruits" and not "end time fruits " (that's us)
http://www.biblepages.web.surftown.se/et03b.htm
C

That helps me imensley. I appreciate it. I do find it so sad that the J/W are being so mislead. I appreciate the link and will look when I have more time to devote to soaking it in...

Thanks again!

Talking about the witness here, well, hmmm...thinking. I don't see that they have to be children, I kinda agree with Mr. David and calvin about we are seen as clean pure children of God every time we repent of our sins, and He remembers them no more. As far as the east is from the west, He shall remember them no more, amen.

With that said, personally I dunno, I mean like, I have the right blood, but haven't felt that particular calling on my life...I think it was shy1 who said "we all have different callings in Him", I guess I just never thought of myself as one of the witnesses. Maybe I should be praying about that?

I do feel like I have a call, but what exactly is it, still not sure, but waiting patiently for HIS direction! amen. YSIC hannah always!

Who Are the 144,000?

The 144,000 martyrs are described in the first vision John sees in book of Revelation, chapter 7. Later, he will see a vision of the great multitudes in white robes. Both groups appear to represent the full number and universal nature of the company of God’s people as Revelation presents them. Let’s look at the details of John’s visions of the 144,000.

The 144,000 is the first group to be sealed and protected from what is coming (Rev. 7:3-8). Revelation 14 describes them as those who were "redeemed from the earth" (14:4). John says "they have not defiled themselves" (verse 4). The 144,000 follow the Lamb wherever he goes and "no lie was found in their mouths" (verse 5).

The context suggests that the 144,000 symbolize those who are true to God and his way. This group is composed of spiritual virgins, who do not commit spiritual fornication by following false religious and philosophical teachings. Neither have they refused to repent of ungodly behavior. They are true to God’s perfect way. Those whom God has "sealed" will survive the outpouring of God’s wrath. They may suffer trials, persecution or even martyrdom, but they are saved for eternal life.

The sealing of God’s servants has much in common with a vision the prophet Ezekiel experienced. He saw human figures in Jerusalem (which is probably a symbol for the righteous remnant among the tribes of Israel) disturbed over the sins being committed in the city (9:4). They also received a "mark" on the forehead, as a sign of their faithfulness to God’s way.

What does it mean to be marked and sealed in the way Revelation 7 speaks of? To be "sealed" is a symbolic way of saying that the 144,000 are identified as belonging to God. They are "marked" as his special people. In ancient times, a seal commonly indicated possession, much in the way a rancher’s brand identifies which cattle belong to him. Merchants in ancient times would also place seals on packages to certify ownership.

To have the seal of God, then, is to belong to God – to be his spiritual child. Paul explains that God has "set his seal of ownership on us" (2 Corinthians 1:22). Christians can be sure of God’s divine care for, "The Lord knows those who are his" (2 Timothy 2:19). The saints are sealed by the Holy Spirit "for the day of redemption" (Ephesians 4:30).

Ownership includes protection from condemnation, and the seal of God protects his people. Those who lack this seal face the judgment of God. The plagues fall only on "those people who did not have the seal of God on their foreheads" (9:4). They are the ones marked by their owners – the devil and his world system (13:16-17; 14:9; 16:2; 19:20; 20:4).

The servants’ "mark" or seal is contrasted with the mark the followers of the "beast" receive. They are branded with the mark of his name or his number on the hand and forehead (13:16; 14:9, 11; 16:2; 19:20; 20:4). This singles out and labels such people as the enemies of God and slaves of the beast.

What is being contrasted in Revelation, then, is the security of the faithful with a fearful world that can find no protection from the judgment of God. The church, powerless before the state apparatus, is being encouraged to see that God has already separated it for eternal life. The authorities or enemies of the church may be able to kill the body, but they cannot harm the soul (Luke 1:68-74; 12:5).

It seems clear that the vision in Revelation 7 has the church in view, not the ancient nation of Israel. The emphasis in the New Testament is on the spiritual people of God or his church. It is not interested in racial distinctions (Galatians 3:28). Paul says that the heir of Abraham is the person who is in Christ (Galatians 3:29). He is the father of all who believe (Romans 4:11).

The believer in Christ is the true Jew (Romans 2:29). Peter speaks of the church as a holy nation and chosen people (1 Peter 2:9). Paul said of the church: "It is we who are the circumcision, we who worship by the Spirit of God, who glory in Christ Jesus" (Philippians 3:3) These are phrases and ideas taken from the Old Testament and applied to the New Testament church. The church is the extension of national Israel, or better, its replacement, elevated to a spiritual plane.

Certain details within the enumeration of the 144,000 indicate that Revelation 7 has the church in view. John has been careful to tell us that there are 12,000 people sealed from each tribe. But we notice several irregularities in his list of the tribes. In fact, John’s list does not agree with the order of any other list of the tribes in the Bible.

The tribe of Dan is missing in his list. To keep the number of tribes at 12, the tribe of Joseph appears twice, once under his own name and once under the name of his son Manasseh. Joseph’s other son, Ephraim, is not mentioned.

John also begins his list with Judah, rather than Reuben, the oldest son of Jacob or Israel. When we ask why Judah is placed ahead of Reuben – and first in the list – we remember that Christ belonged to the tribe of Judah (Hebrews 7:14). John seems to be identifying the church as the new Israel by pointing to Jesus Christ as the Messiah.

At the same time, John seems to be downplaying the rights of the firstborn in ancient Israel.

In the Genesis lists of the tribes, it is obvious why Reuben, as first-born, must come first. Inheritance in the family was tied to the first-born in a special way. To violate this procedure of placing another tribe in the first-born position, as Revelation does, is to make an important statement about the meaning of inheritance in spiritual Israel. It has nothing to do with race or birth. Election is by grace through Christ – and it is given to the church.

John’s list omits the tribe of Dan. This tribe settled in Laish after the Exodus and lapsed into idolatrous worship (Judges 18:30). Later, the king of Israel, Jeroboam, set up one of two great worship centers opposed to the God of Israel in Dan (1 Kings 12:28-29). Though Dan appears in different locations in the Genesis lists, he does appear. No matter what his spiritual condition, his inheritance in Israel was guaranteed by birth, not moral uprightness. His omission in Revelation implies inheritance comes not through human birth – rather, it comes through faith in Christ.

Interestingly, we do find Dan included among the tribes listed in Ezekiel (48:32). Yet, despite the fact that the last chapters of Ezekiel serve as a model for parts of Revelation, Dan is omitted in chapter 7. Dan’s omission from John’s list must have made an important point to the church about idolatrous worship. Some of the seven churches are chastised for idolatry – that is, they are selling Christ out for Caesar worship and for participation in the ways of this world. Revelation implies that if they continue to do so, their candlestick will be removed – as was Dan’s. They will not be included in the register or roll of spiritual Israel.

The irregularities in the list of tribes help us to identify the 144,000 of the "tribes" of Israel as the church – the true spiritual Israel. This understanding of "Israel" accords well with the historical situation during John’s day.

Is the church to be literally limited to 144,000? Circumstances militate against such an interpretation. If true, it would mean that only some of those who accepted Christ in the first century are saved, and none since, as the number would have been filled to the full early on.

Revelation’s use of numbers also suggests that the 144,000 are not meant as a literal count. Since Israel is a symbol for the church, we should not take the 144,000 as a literal number either. Revelation is a book of cosmic symbols, and it uses numbers such as seven and twelve in symbolic ways. Twelve seems to be used as a foundational number, such as in the twelve apostles and twelve tribes of Israel. The number 144,000 (12 x 12 x 1000) would then tell us the church is a complete "nation" of large size.

Copyright 2000 Worldwide Church of God

http://www.wcg.org/lit/bible/Rev/144000.htm

OK I am no expert when it comes to Revelation, so somebody please explain something to me.
In Chapter 7 we have only TWO groups. The 144000 and the saints who came through the tribulation. Am I right.
Where are the rest of the saints?...the ones that died through the ages.?
And in Chapter 8 the seventh seal gets broken and more tribulation hits the earth...but also prayers of the saints go up with the incense. Where are these saints? Still on earth? ...but the saints of the trib is already in heaven in chapter 7

Maybe "time" is really the problem in understanding all this. Does a vision work in a timeline or does time sort of go out the door?

Sorry if I appear really stupid here, but then again, we are here to learn.
love Cornelius

This is a complexed question, in that it takes a lot of scripture and understanding of scripture to explain and even then most won't get it. The 144,000 are the firstfruits, saints, the elect that meet Christ in the air at His return to earth. They are Men and women who have achieved Christlikeness on earth. Since there is neither Greek nor Jew Bond nor free Male nor Female everyone is eligible. They have been forgiven of all of their sins and are blameless before the throne of God. If you repent and are forgiven by God it never happened. These have left all and forsaken all to follow Christ. Every one in this group are Jewish by adoption and redemption out of every nation tribe and tongue.


Revelation 5
9 For You were slain, And have redeemed us to God by Your blood Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation,
10 And have made us kings and priests to our God; And we shall reign on the earth."

Luke 20
35 But those who are counted worthy to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry nor are given in marriage;

Lu 14
26 - "If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple.

Lu 14
27 And whoever does not bear his cross and come after Me cannot be My disciple.

Lu 14
33 So likewise, whoever of you does not forsake all that he has cannot be My disciple


Charlie

prophetess Elisabeth sherrie elijah from www.amightywind.com says in prophecy 82 the Bride of Christ has 288.000 people. I was wondering, are they these 144.000 jews plus 144.000 gentiles? sounds logical to me.

Hold on to what is true and correct. Cling to the word of Lord and if it does not hold to His truth is not truth but a lie from satan.....

It does not contradict the Bible, and the Lord has shown me these prophecies are indeed from him, as I have prayed for some things and the answer showed up in the next prophecy she gave.

Joeri, I have a problem with self-proclaimed prophets. Especially, when they are seeking monetary gifts for themselves, not a ministry. I went and looked at your website. Though not in lots of detail, but some things I did look at, just didn't set well within my spirit. Be careful of false teachings. There are many who teach false doctrines and false prophecies. Don't be fooled. Lean not on your on understanding but lean on the WORD of GOD. GOD's WORD is truth. Man can manipulate and change it, but the truth can only be found in GOD.

Maybe it is just me, but I have always thought that one of the personality traits the 144,000 personnel would have is humility. Loads of it. They would see themselves as nothing in the scheme of things. Being the last. Sure they were only enough to be servants....those are the ones that my Jesus would choose I think.

so, how would they say "I am"?

leia

They are the remnant of Jews kept themselves clean. Not agreeing to the death pact with anitchrist, not yet come into a saving relationship with christ. Once we are taken in the rapture, these will be led into the wilderness, where God himself will remove their scales from their eyes and they will recognize Christ as Messiah. They will have the seal of God as so to be protected from Gods wrath that begins the same day we are raptured and they are sealed. My opinion of what the scripture say.

leia, what a beautiful heart you have, my sister, my friend.
"the first shall be last, and the last shall be first."
you are correct.
(as i see it)

love to you all.
keep on seeking.
keep on asking.
it shall be given.
For God is generous and kind.
His loving-kindness endures
forever.

love,
bz

100% truth you speak. The Birde of Christ is recognisible by two things, they have the Likeness of Yashua, Jesus Christ, and they were the mantle of humility. Mama Heidi is one of them. http://www.visionvideo.com/111-1111111-1111111_3687.vhtml

How do you think you can recognise a selfproclaimed prophet from a real one?
When God calls her a prophetess, she has the right to call herself a prophetess too just as Jesus Christ has the right to say ''I am the son of God. God is my Father''.
Do tell me which did not line up with your spirit Im interested.
I have prayed to the Lord, the only true eternal God, to put some stuff there or to answer specific questions through her and so He did.
proof enough for me. Ask and you shall be given. I even wrecked a busstop near my church with a prayer

Joeri, the Bible tells us that many will claim to be prophets, but are not. The only prohets that are 100%, will tell us 100% and it will happen 100%. Those that are exactly 100% are those from GOD. Those who claim it for themselves usually do this for money only and are fake. Their prophecies may seem real, but are manipulated and are not real. Your prophet states there will be 288,000, but the BIBLE is clear that there are 144,000. That is the tale-tale sign that she is misleading you.

You cannot change GOD'S WORD. The 144,000 will be Jewsih decendancts from eeach of the 12 tribes listed in Revelation. I do believe that there will be none jews (gentiles) that are to become the tribualtion saints mentioned in relevelation. BUT GOD did not give us a number of them.

There are 255 scriptures that deal with prophets in the bible. Here
is the 255 scriptures, and a good search tool for scriptures to help you....

http://www.studylight.org/desk/?query=prop...en&enter=Search

Right on Tigs! No way a real prophet says even a single word that is in conflict with the clear teachings of the bible. It's one thing to disagree about the meaning of scripture, but something as clear as 144 as opposed to 288 is indisputable. God's word cannot be changed any more than Gods LAW can be changed.

Here's something else to think about in regards to prophets.

Matthew 23:34-39
34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city: 35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar. 36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation. 37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! 38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate. 39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

She is speaking about the Bride of Christ.
I certainly do not assume that bride is 100% Jewish. Sounds quite logical to me to have 144.000 jews and 144000 Gentiles in Christs bride.
It does not contradict the bible.

Joeri, did you read the scriptures that I had for you on the website??? The Bible doesn't say anything about the number of GENTILES that will be in the bride of Christ. I certainly hope that there will be millions come to Christ, but no number is given. This prophecy does NOT line up with scripture. It is misleading. Please go back and read about prophets, so that you can discern the true prophets.

How can it be logical. Joeri how can you base what you believe on "sounds quite logical"
The scripture is quite clear about the amount of people here. 144000 JEWISH virgins plus they are all male. So if you are not male...you are not part of the 144000 and if you are not Jewish...out you go as well.

144,000 on the earth

12,000 from all the twelve tribes of Israel, excluding Dan

They are sealed in their forehead

They are the servants of God

The 144,000 are with the Lamb

They are pictured on Mount Zion

They have the Father's name written in their foreheads

They sung a new song

They were before the throne

No one could learn that song, except the 144,000

They were not defiled with women

They were virgins (it appears these were not married)

They follow Jesus

They were ransomed or purchased from among men

They are the firstfruits unto God

There was no guile or lies found in their mouth

They are without fault or defect (or are blameless before the throne of God)

How can the Jehovah's witnesses believe that they can be part of the 144,000? Isn't that what they believe? Thanks for your above post.

Do you not know that The revelation of God is enduring? Who has guessed the Cross before Christ came? Noone. Who has dreamed of eradication of circumcision when the torah is so clear on it? noone. but it happened. Why then is it so hard to accept that NOW is the time that God revealed the number of Gentiles? I can discern well enough to know that I prayed for many things who then later appeared in her prophecies.

Jeori, it MUST LINE UP with GOD'S WORD 100%. If what is being told to you does not line up 100%; it is not prophecy from GOD. The Bible tells us that many will come saying this is the Messiah, or that is the Messiah. We are not to believe All that is told to us. We are to depend strictly on GOD'S WORD to confirm the prophecy. Your prophetess' prophecies does NOT align with GOD'S WORD.

Please make sure that what you are getting from her, aligns with GOD'S WORD. Don't be lead astray.

Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Matthew 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

Matthew 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

Mark 13:22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.

2 Corinthians 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.

2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

Amen,
yes it has to line up with the word of God. Test everything with His words.
That is the only way to go.
That is the only way I can survive in these days.
There are so many deceivers coming out of the woodwork. I go to my bible and read the words and always find truth. God must be the light in our path.

I think I would unravel without God and His Holy Bible.

God's
Word is to make itself a home in our hearts. It is to become
a part of all we think, all we say, and all we do.
When God's Word is woven into the very fabric of our lives,
we will never unravel. Thank you Lord. For I feel a little frayed around
the edges today.

Colossians 3:16 is a great help today.
Our Lord is our help everyday

Hello marta..

Good post.. I'm very glad you ask who the 144,000 people where in rev 7 and 14.. My friend at work is a J/W and he ask me to come to one of his gathers last wed.. So I went.. And I could not believe what they where teaching.. They where saying only 144,000 people will go to heaven.. They also believe that satan didn't get cast out of heaven till 1914.. And that is why world one started.. I have been in deep prayer over the J/W. the bible clearly states that who ever calls on christ will be saved not just a 144,000.. The 144,000 our jews from the 12 jewish tribes talk about in rev 7 there seal on the forehead so no harm would come apond them well witnessing on earth to those left behind.. It hurts me alot that the J/W our adding on the book of revelation which we our told not.. Please lets all pray for the J/W would open there eyes to see what there doing is misleading..

Revelation 22:18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone ADDS to these things. God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book

The J/W think they are the 144,000 not the jews.. Please pray for them so the plagues of revelation will not harm them.. please pray that they understand they our adding to this book..

Lord I come before you tonight and ask that you would open the eys of the J/W and let them understand that the 144,000 our not the only people going to heaven that the 144,000 are jews who will witness to those who are not saved during the 7 years of judgement.. Lord let them know the devil was cast out of heaven before man was even born not 1914.. I pray all this in Jesus name Amen

How on earth would it be possible when I pray to God that whatever I ask to show up in her prophecies does show up if she is a false prophet? As for lining up,
as I said Gods word is an ongoing revelation. Dont you see that what you say (this is NOT meant as an accusation whatsoever!) is about the same what the Jews told to paul? Paul preached baptism and NO circumcision. not only did he say circumcision was unimportant, he was totally against it warning people against it.
Saying if you do it you are outside of Christs grace.
Thats why he got persecuted for those who lived under the slavery of the law (instead of the Holy Spirit of the Living God may he be praised forever ) told him the same thing:that he was preaching against the word of God, the torah. And, he was. in some ways. He preached that all those 613 laws are not to be kept anymore because it was only a master till Christ Jesus who brought the new old law of perfect Love and Trust, and he preached that the covenant of which God says in his torah that whomever does not keep it (circumcision) must be expelled or die (sorry cant really remember just remember God really didnt like it if anyone was not circumsized to say it as an understatement.) THIS WAS TOTALLY NEW! EVERY PROPHET that has come came with NEW things! God said in Joel 2 that in these end times he will throw his spirit over all his servants and children from the least to the greatest, the slave and the free, what do you think they prophecy? certainly not old stuff? we have the bible for that. no, all prophets speak new stuff or simply warn. There was not even the idea of a Christ being a sin sacrifice before Isaiah, and when Isaiah came preaching chapter 53 of His prophecies he was preaching something unheard of! It was a new revelation of God! Isaiah died through being cut while lying i a hollow tree for all this new stuff...
The God of Abraham was not the same as that of Israel in Egypt!
Oh yes it was the same person. But he Brought something completely NEW, namely, His name (JHWH). In exodus you can find him talking to Moses saying he ONLY revealed himself as ALmighty God to Abraham Isaac and Jakob.
Not as JHWH. newnewnew God is always sending new things. The ancient Jews I think didnt even believe God had a son! That too, was a new revelation. His plan will not be fulfilled until the end and right till the end God will give pieces of the puzzle to different people for it is together that we have been given to know the secrets of the Lord.
Compare the Words of Yahshua/Jesus Christ to those of the old testament. ALL of the parables are COMPLETELY NEW. What Jesus revealed on the mind and ways of God transcended all that has gone before. Jesus himself called a scribe who discipled Jesus one who had a new treasure the first one being Moses and the second one being Jesus (+what Jesus teaches)...
The book of revelation is COMPLETELY NEW. everything in the book of revelation save a few things were kept HIDDEN until that time. And Nowhere has our beloved Lord ever stopped revealing himself! On the contrary Joel 2 says right now is the greatest outpouring of the holy spirit including prophecies...
This is where faith comes in... recognising the voice of the Lord because he speaks to everyone, and NEVER trust your own reason (thats what paul did while persecuting christians) , in order to decide what is from God and what is not...
God has his hand in many things, much more things than I think christians think He has.
But enough babblings from my side Godblessyoulots

THANK YOU so much for this I thought they believed Christ came in 1914 or something which is why i believed it to be false but since my wizard grandpa who has ruined my whole life (tried too, God saves) was born in 1914 too. I always was reminded of that when i heard about the Jehovas witnesses. now i know they might very well believe the truth at least about this. not about the number of people in heaven.

Joeri, there are also lots of false prophets out there. So we have to be careful. Like I said, just a few things that come to pass is not showing that this prophet is of GOD. They have to line up 100% with GOD'S WORD and they also have to come to pass 100%of the time, too. As for what the Bible says about False prophets, please study the WORD so that you can understand my warning about that. May the LORD bless you also, Joeri.

This link pulls up all the scriptures on prophets, so that you may understand the fullness of GOD'S WORD on this subject.

http://www.studylight.org/desk/?query=prop...en&enter=Search

This link on False prophets...it is scripture concerning false prophets...

http://www.studylight.org/desk/?l=en&query...hets&new=1&sr=1

I agree with a lot of what you have said today.

I agree about the circumcision. Paul was talking about the flesh of our WORKS as not satisfying GOD. It is still practiced today and it is a part of the Babylonian Talmudic laws. Even when the flesh was circumcised the Jews did not follow GOD'S WORD. So in this you are correct. Jesus told the Pharisees about their perversion of the laws, (being made into the Babylonian Talmud Laws-613), you won't find argument about these laws being man-made and not of GOD.

So we have some things that we both agree about.

Jesus fulfilled 350 prophecies about him too. You can find a wonderful study on this...

http://www.christian-forum.net/index.php?act=ST&f=18&t=5178

I'd rather not be so fearful, and realise that even if I were to believe a false one, as everyone believes lies one way or another only God is in full possession of Truth, and that is why Gods son died. Since I have become so afraid of sin and believing what is wrong I only got scared and in the end it got so far that I heard satans voice much louder than the Lords. Perfect Love casts out all fear

But its not that some things come to pass that make me believe her, but that I pray to God for certain things, such as sealing off prophecy 78 (i do not remember why I did that though or when it will be unsealed) and they happened...
Or the number of saints in the Bride... Or when I was afraid to judge others yet at the same time feel supressed by enemies of God and me, (which goes hand in hand as one who loves God is never my enemy and one who hates God is my enemy, even though I dont pray against them but for them that they might know the Lord) I asked may I pray for vengeance or not, please say something about it in the next prophecy. Then came a prophecy named:Pray that I Yahu'vah send my enemies to the winepress of my wrath. (something like that)
these are just some examples. However her entire ministry is a last chance ministry, and thus it shows a specific side of God which other true prophets might seem to completely contradict.

And you trigger

O sorry, I will check after I finished this reply.

Thanks makes me glad

But it WAS a part of Gods laws, and an important one, as well UNTIL Christ came and brought a new covenant of forgiveness, which was prophecised about in Jeremiah. A covenant which does not, like the first law, separate stuff such as good from evil and pure from impure, but instead accepts the fullness of Gods creation as pure for all impurities are washed away by Christ Living blood
including even that of animals it seems, as after Christ, God declared all previously known as impure animals, as pure. And he did the same with our skin which used to be cut off in the first covenant. (man how can I say that politely )

True. circumcision seems to be like symbolically cutting off what should not belong...

613? I know they say the Torah has 613 commandments (of which 365 Thou shalt nots, or was it 365 Thou shalts? its a miracle in itself that the number is the same as days in a year anyhow ) but I dont see what that has to do with the talmud sorry?

In fact Christ fulfilled much much more prophecies than that. And many are still to be fulfilled, or are fulfilled right now, yet people overlook those prophecies.
I cant convince a judaist that the fact that God didnt want the legs of the pascha lamb broken is prophetically speaking on Jesus for instance, whos legs were not broken at the Cross...

www.messiahrevealed.org is a good one too!

Joeri, thank you for responding to me. Please do some studying on those 613 laws. Google Sanhedrin, Babylonian Talmud, and Noahide Laws. It opened my eyes up to some things that I once thought was truth, and now know the TRUTH that only GOD gives.

The Sanhedrin consider themselves to be the ultimate judges, and the things that they believe are built on Mysticism. It became watered down and man tried to say that the Torah was not as important as what men have written concerning GOD'S LAW. I have been in a study on this very subject. If you would like the links, pm me and I will share them with you.


Pray and ask GOD to lead you into new understanding on the things that I have shared with you...concerning the false prophets, and understanding the true prophets of GOD. I am praying also for you.

May the LORD continue to bless you.

I studied them for quite a while and am curently reading exodus again

But you do agree the torah comes from God right?

I am interested in Gods law but very little in what men who are less nothing in the eternal Kingdom of God think of those laws. Why give them attention? I prefer to keep my attention on the God of Light than on the dark

Amen I have prayed I can use prayer alright Just yesterday my earthly father has not allowed me in his home anymore and its like god suddenly healed me much more and only now says I am your father because he never wanted to be that because he feared men in false pride.

and you