I will ask please that you leave your concordances out of this discussion and rather hear what the spirit is saying and not what vine and strong's define. Is that fair to start?

Isaiah 28:9-10
Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

The Word of Yahweh always interprets the Word. We never have to go any further than the Truth which is written to understand and have wisdom. This is for His glory!

Matthew 13:18
Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.

Matthew 13:19
When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.

Here Yahshua is giving a parable as an example to what happens to any one (notice there is no respector of persons in the passage) who hears the word of the kingdom and because the person does not understand what he/she is hearing; the wicked one comes and taketh away; and this would be an example of seed received by the way side.

So who sows the seed of the kingdom?
Matthew 13:37
He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;

Where can we find the good seed sown? First we find it in His Word. And that word can be carried also by His children who receive His word/seed on good solid ground;

Matthew13:23
But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

I believe this is a good place to pause and discuss. Yahshua is not saying in the parable of the sower; that there are children of a certain race who will never receive His word; Remember He is no respector of persons! The Bible AND the parables and the revelation are available to all nations, tribes and tongues and He prophesied it would be published in all the earth.

What I believe and understand is He is describing the way for which an individual hears and receives His word-every word regarding the kingdom of God! He provides for us many examples (isn't He wonderful) through parables of how the Word is received and He also gives us the result of how His Word is received and what happens.

I will explain to you how I have fit a particular example of His seed sown. I remember; not to long ago I was reading the Bible and I jumped up for joy that I understood what He was saying in that particular passage, I was so thrilled I called someone to share- and the person on the phone had no idea what I was talking about, I explained how I received the understanding in detail and after that they said "Yeah; that makes sense!!" We were both then overjoyed. But then something happened, I hung up and went about household duties, cooking dinner and my partner talking about bills and such...by the end of the night, I'd already lost the joy I'd had a few hours earlier And Yahshua explains why:

Matthew 24:22
He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.

I remember I even recalled that parable later that night and I shook my head at myself and thought; I have to be stronger in Him and not allow certain outside influences to come and choke what I consider a nugget or glimpse into His Kingdom

We are all children of God. He is Creator and there no one beside Him; to say that there is, is to actually rob God of His glory. About the only thing man can create is things made with hands from the sources of what God created. Without Yahweh, we cannot even breathe. He is our lifeline and also our Redeemer from the fallen state; and He did it not by power, not by might, but by Spirit and Truth.

OK. Let's discuss and let's try to keep the Word in the light and glory.

There are 2 things here, good ground and good seed.

Good ground is defined in that one sentence: Your understanding.
Good seed is harder to define using the bible.
The first mention of seed is in Genesis 1:12. And that is the only mention of the seed being good; i.e. the vegetation.



That is Mark 4:19 or Matthew 13:22, not Matthew 24:22. And the emphasis is different in both. In Mark, the emphasis is on the word.

Mar 4:19 And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful.

In Matthew, the emphasis is on the hearer. But, starting from Matthew 13:19, the seed sown is the word of the kingdom.

Mat 13:22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.

But, the 'he' is among the thorns. What are the thorns? Didn't Paul have a 'thorn in his side?' What was that? A handicap? I don't know. Using the bible to define 'thorn,' you have to go to Judges.

Jdg 2:3 Wherefore I also said, I will not drive them out from before you; but they shall be as thorns in your sides, and their gods shall be a snare unto you.

In 2 Samuel 23:6, the 'thorns' are the sons of Belial, so 'thorns' is probably the lesser gods that the people worshipped.

So, we can rephrase that statement to read 'he also that received the word of the kingdom among the lesser gods the people worship is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.'

We can go further with it can't we? We can if you want to define what the 'fruit' is and what 'unfruitful' means.
There are 12 fruits of the spirit: There is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
meekness, temperance, goodness, and righteousness, and truth. How would you be unfruitful?

By turning your fruits toward the world and sharing your fruits with the world and their lesser gods and becoming bound by the law. There is no law controlling the fruits of the spirit. We are told, 'What is bound on earth is bound in heaven and what is loosed on earth is loosed in heaven.'

Can we equate the word with fruit? I don't know. In Matthew 13:22, the word is choked and therefore the receiver becomes unfruiful, so I guess you could.

What do y'all think?

I will ask please that you leave your concordances out of this discussion and rather hear what the spirit is saying and not what vine and strong's define. Is that fair to start?

No its not,,,,your not a Greek scholar!!! Therefore when we come across words that need to be defined,,,you will render your definition,,,instead of getting the true definition,,,because your not a Greek scholar nor do you speak Greek.......Its just a way for you to say what you believe,,,while taking a a major useful tool that can prove you wrong out of the way ...If your words were true they could stand against any doctrine and concordance....

This is how I always had read that parable about seed (let me know what you think) OK you know when you open the Bible and begin reading; you might be reading James for example; and James is a seed of Yahshua, as also James is a servent of Yahshua too. We have the Word available to us for a reason; a very good reason at that. So you're reading James and perhaps there are certain passages that you might not understand so much; but there are passages that come so easily and readily and you remember(rooted) those passages and begin using and applying them in your daily life and walk, such as how you manage your life and how you deal with others. That's how I understand the Bible as a whole. All of God's seeds are in the Book. Some very God loving and fearing people had to die so we could behold their testimony given by God-of Him and about Him. And the Son had to die so we could behold the fullness of the Book. And we need it; I feign to imagine my life today without His Word as my Rock and fortress. I'm a mess, I admit that. I mess up daily, but daily I am reminded to take up my cross and follow Him. So what do you think? Good seed=His Word via prophets and saints (disciples)





I realised when I began writing this thread that it was going involve a great deal more Scripture referencing than Matthew 24, but I figured I'd let that be a starting point. Not to mention I'm more familiar with the Gospel according to Matthew; than Mark for instance. That is interesting in Matt 13:22. Does it indicate that the word (seed) is being preached among a group/congregation of people figuratively defined as 'thorns' and though some may be amidst the thorns and they hear the word, the thorns being possibly (rebellious) make it difficult for the word to take root?



That's true Paul was given a thorn in his side to keep him from being exalted if I'm not mistaken. Here's the passage:
2 Corinthians 12:7
And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

The thorn is in the flesh, the messenger of Satan? I think possibly it was something to due with Pauls eyes?


What would be lesser gods of today; like anyone that deifies himself or would they be considered pagans etc? I see why it is important to yoke continually with those that believe in Yahshua and also read the Bible on a regular basis. I think that also is where thorns arise amongst the hearer(s). I used to be this way, I rarely ever read the Bible, I would just go off the things people were saying and the things I'd read here and there and think that was enough to know what I was talking about, and even now I don't ever claim to know all things in the Bible, but I don't think there is anything wrong with being confident in what I do know. Considering also He is all I have and He is creating in us all a new person; picking us all up from the fallen state and changing us to the point when He resurrects us into that 'new' person. What do you think?



Well I'd say being unfruitful is being the opposite of those wonderful attributes. For me personally they are like steps beginning with truth and working your way through to the last which is love. Truth must be our foundation and nowhere on earth can "eternal" truth be found except in the Bible.
What's interesting to is I have met people who were Buddhist which had most if not all of those qualities (even some truth) but they do not believe in Jesus Christ And that reminds me of this passage:
2 Timothy 3:5
Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.



I believe yes the Word can be equated to various figuratives; fruit, seed, oil, wine, bread, etc..Wow it is good for food, like the tree of life which bares 12 manners of fruit in Revelation. Really almost makes me feel as though the Word of God is for you and your walk in life; and also for me, and though our walk is different and we deal with different issues, we have available to us each- in a very intimate way-God's Word. What I mean is you may be having to learn temperance ; whilst I am having to learn patience and thus when we meet or even discuss on this forum and "disagree" it may be because we are in our lesson and there to assist one another through, something like that?
I'm rambling, so at this point I pray you do have patience and temperance in dealing with my ramblings hehe Not to mention it's 1:30 AM and I'm getting sleepy.

Anyway, please discuss more when you have time. I really appreciate the way you view the Word of God and also the way you talk about Him.

Revelation 7:4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of ALL THE TRIBES OF THE CHILDREN OF ISRAEL.

7:9 After this I beheld, and lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of ALL NATIONS, AND KINDREDS, AND PEOPLE, AND TONGUES, stood before the throne and before the Lamb, clohted with white robes, and palms in their hands:

14:2-3 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the HUNDRED AND FORTY AND FOUR THOUSAND, WHICH WERE REDEEMED FROM THE EARTH.


The seed was literal....there are the tribes of Israel. The seed is spiritual in that anyone becomes adopted into the family upon their love of Christ. That DOES NOT NEGATE THE PHYSICAL.

Please note that there are separate counts given of those that will stand before Christ. If He makes a distinction between those of the "children of Israel" and others then who are we to disagree?

[quote name='whirlwind' date='Nov 15 2008, 06:27 AM' post='262104']
[quote name='~Selah~' post='261589' date='Nov 14 2008, 02:06 AM']I will ask please that you leave your concordances out of this discussion and rather hear what the spirit is saying and not what vine and strong's define. Is that fair to start?

Isaiah 28:9-10
Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

The Word of Yahweh always interprets the Word. We never have to go any further than the Truth which is written to understand and have wisdom. This is for His glory!

Matthew 13:18
Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.

Matthew 13:19
When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.

Here Yahshua is giving a parable as an example to what happens to any one (notice there is no respector of persons in the passage) who hears the word of the kingdom and because the person does not understand what he/she is hearing; the wicked one comes and taketh away; and this would be an example of seed received by the way side.

So who sows the se . . .

This happens more recently lately where it will post only half of my post. And I end up putting two or three of the same post.

I think that there are two ways to interpret the bible while you are in the flesh. But, both of those way are of the flesh. That is why Jesus spoke in parables. Even those apostles that he gave insight into the kingdom did not believe him. They had no reference point; they were trying to figure out where Jesus was coming from. Our reference point is the physical. Even the bible tells you 'Those born of the flesh are flesh and those born of the spirit are spirit.' And Jesus Christ was the only one born of the spirit. We are told to have His mind within you. The spirit and the flesh are two different worlds totally. Of course, we cannot negate the flesh because without the flesh we would not be able to act. With the flesh, we can praise God.

If we have to use the bible to interpret the bible, the apostles had to do the same thing. They only had the Old Testament to speak from. They used that for their illustrations.

Jdg 2:3 Wherefore I also said, I will not drive them out from before you; but they shall be as thorns in your sides, and their gods shall be a snare unto you.

Who was ‘, the messenger of Satan to buffet me . . .’

It was not an eyesight problem. It was a messenger, a person. Who was that? Warren Buffet? What is a buffet? A buffet is a countertop used to serve things on. So, the messenger of Satan served him things.

I will rephrase that. The thorns are the people of Satan.



Yes, and the thorns are? The thorns are already grown. It won’t be difficult for the word to take root, the thorns choke out the word that is preached.

And the ‘seeds’ produce the fruit of the spirit and those fruits grow on the Tree of Life . . . tree of life which bares 12 manners of fruit in Revelation.



Yes, but what are those wonderful attributes? There is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, faith, meekness, temperance, goodness, and righteousness, and truth. How would you be unfruitful? But wait, there is only 11! What happened to Judas? What did he repesent? There were 12 apostles and one was a demon; a thorn in the flesh! A messenger of Satan.



So, what does Matthias represent? His name means 'gift of Jah.' So would he represent giving?

What are the opposite of those? There is hate, sadness, war, short-temper, violence, hopelessness, boldness, drunkenness, falsity, ungodliness, and untruth.

But, there is also no law against these things either; it is up to you to not do these things. But, these things do not exist in the spiritual world. There is no restraint in the spiritual world.

In the spiritual world, you cannot stand in front of Christ if any of these things are in your spirit. That is the reason we have been put in the flesh to get these things out of us while we can.

Who are the 12 apostles?

Peter
James
John
Andrew
Phillip
Batholomew
Thomas
Matthew
Simon
Thaddeus
James 2
Matthias

The 12 fruits?

love,
joy,
peace,
longsuffering,
gentleness,
faith,
meekness,
temperance,
goodness,
righteousness,
truth,
giving.

1Co 3:4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?

That tells me that during the time of Jesus, people then were a whole lot smarter than we are and there were people who associated the apostles with the gifts. I'm sure that there is another way to take that verse, like Paul could have saved these people, so they're Paul's people, but who was Apollos? There was no apostle named Apollos, so what are we supposed to think? Really, I could give my opinion, but you know that's like . . . everybody has one.

In the parable of the sower, the sower went out to sow seeds. Are the fruits of the spirit seeds or are the seeds from the fruit from the trees that have grown. In Genesis is the first mention of seeds.

Gen 1:11 And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

The fruit trees are personified here with the word 'his.' 'His kind.' The fruit tree produces fruit with the seed in the fruit.

So, does that mean that each fruit of the spirit has the seeds of that fruit within the fruit? I think it does.

That was very profound Gregg. I think it does too.

Thank you......

Of course there are literal seeds. I'm a literal person born of a literal mother (egg) and dad (sperma) Only one was born of a virgin, only ONE. That is why we who believe in Him (Yahshua) must be reborn! And it starts with a tiny mustard seed of faith. Otherwise I guess I'm going to have to start eating me some mustard seeds; since you believe the seeds are literal/genetic.

You are being juvenile as well as blind. If you don't agree simply disagree. Sarcasm isn't attractive.

That's true and also what you said put in my remembrence this:
Matthew 13:52
Then said he unto them, Therefore every scribe which is instructed unto the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man that is an householder, which bringeth forth out of his treasure things new and old.
(once again I think that treasure can only be found in Matthew) Not that I disregard the other disciples!! No no! I personally really love the account/witness given of Yahshua, according to Matthew and John is a close second I think I once heard that Matthew's account was written for "us laymen folk" hehe


Hmmm...And that is because Apostle Paul was hardcore loving the Lord and very very passionate; so passionate that he was throwing (those he thought were infidels) out of the temples/churches; until he heard the voice from heaven from Yahshua saying "Saul Saul, why are you persecuting me?" Then Saul became Paul and became one of the most passionate and zealous workers for the building of the church of Yahweh-so I guess he had to have someone/something to keep him humble lest he think of himself as too exalted OR perhaps others would even want to worship him; which did happen once I think.



You're not suggesting genetically are you? If I'm undertanding all of what you're saying; I would think you are saying people of satan; ie those who do his bidding and his will regardless of what race or lineage they are born of/from?





I agree there are thorns everywhere; even I have been a thorn on occasion or two A thorn in my own side actually. I wonder why one of the fuits is not humility and humbleness. Those are important attributes as well. We must suffer humility on behalf of His word. An example would be an un-believer is lashing out against the Bible and you (general you, not you) defending the Word feel that piercing inside you and rather than suffer it; you lash out...that would not be suffer humility. And that is a very tough attribute to have. I have felt a sensation of Messiah's pain before and it will make one want to rent their heart.

I have to take a break...I woudl like to continue discussing and learning Gregg; you are very helpful for my journey or our journey...

I have no idea why there are slashed like this / in different places...I edited and something got out of whack and then there were those slashes...sorry, I have no idea what happened nor how to fix it.

I fixed it

Gregg,
Another thing I just remembered! I was studying this a few months ago, but did not have 'enough' substance to post a topic about it-but I found that there are *hours* mentioned in the Gospels. There are a few hours missing I think maybe like 4th and 7th? Anyway...the last hour Yahshua gives is in John and it's the 11th hour...no twelfth? I found that interesting because there are 12 disciples, now we've discussed twelve manners of fruit, but only 11 hours..

Then in Revelation we are taught about an *hour* of temptation and the beast going into perdition for one hour.

Thoughts?

I'll be around a bit later. I've got some things to do so I'm sort of back and forth from pc to other duties.

I wasn't being sarcastic. Once again I was pointing you in a direction, the direction of the seed of faith. And also...it is not always "simple" to disagree, you ought to know this WW. It's one thing to disagree on petty things such as the taste of coffee, some say yummy, others say yuk. But when the disagreement is about truth, it becames far more difficult. Both of us believe we serve Yahshua and we both love Him, but one of us is deceived by another who came in his own name:
John 5:43
I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

You are consistant to quote Murry and that other bullinger person and also you use the concordance as you tool to back up your belief and doctrine. I once read where you actually used a false doctrine and admitted it, to back up your serpent seed/sex in the garden teaching. Now THAT is not attractive.

Hypocrite !

IC - CI - MM

You are one HATE FILLED female. (notice I didn't use the word lady...ladies don't slander others)

Yes, this disagreement is about the truth....YOU CAN'T TAKE THE TRUTH YOU SLANDERER. You can't take it because you can't see it and until you dump the baggage you are carrying around you never will be able to. Yes, we both believe we serve Christ and I don't see Him in you at all anymore.

Revelation 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever LOVETH AND MAKETH A LIE."

Before you accused me of "twisting scripture." I repeatedly asked you to produce said scripture...you never did because you couldn't. Well, here you go again. Guess what ....

IT'S TIME TO PUT UP OR SHUT UP !

Produce everything you accuse me of....everything.


If you "read" where I used false doctrine.....quote it, it should be a simple task especially as I "admitted it."

If I'm consistent to quote Murray....quote it, if I consistently use it then it should be a simple task.

And, while you're at it....quote all the twisted scripture I use. I'm still waiting for that.

Yes I use the concordance you nitwit...so should you and then you might actually learn something. Yes I quote Bullinger...he is a renowned Biblical scholar.

And by the way Selah....I don't need YOU to point me in any direction. The Holy Spirit leads me every day and He is doing one terrific job so far....you should try it some time.

That is SO interesting!

First, we have the hoseholder hiring laborers starting in Mat. 20. He goes out the 3rd, 6th, 9th, and 11th hour.

In Luke 22:53, Jesus is talking to the chief priests and the elders and Judas in the garden of Gethsemene and they had the scene and everything, Jesus said ' . . . this is your hour and the power of darkness.' And that is when Peter denied him.

I point that out because when Jesus was on the cross, from the 6th until the 9th hour there was darkness; 6,7,8,9.

All through Matthew, there were statements about people being healed 'in that hour' and 'from that hour,' 'the selfsame hour.' That could be the 1 hour.

And no, there is no mention of the 2nd, 4th, 5th. But you can infer the 12th from the parable of the householder paying the servants when the people hired the 11th hour were paid the same as the rest and the complaint was 'they only worked 1 hour and they got the same pay as us?' so that means the 12th hour they got paid.

In Luke 24:33 there is only 11 apostles. Matthias was not chosen to replace Judas by the Lord. The 10th hour is mentioned in John 1:39. In John 2:4, Jesus mentions 'mine hour,' but why did he call it 'mine?' Which hour was it? In John 4:25, the 7th hour is mentioned. The 9th hour is the hour of prayer.

In Rev. 8:1, it may be the sign that in the 7th hour it is shortened, I don't know; the silence lasts 1/2 hour.

You have an hour of judgement and an hour of temption and 3 hours of darkness and Jesus's hour.

Let my spirit think on that. And thank you.

Remember this Whirlwind:

You're right....I am sarcastic with you. That's too bad.

Father Abraham

This is for you Whirlwind. I love you because He loves you and He is calling you back into His Gospel of love and salvation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMZj0520v0g

I thought also it was interesting. And plain, nothing hidden. We have the revelation, we just aren't fully there yet I too will do some more study and I look forward to hearing what you or anyone else finds regarding this. I took notice of the time and what Yahshua was doing at that time. Like I think it was the 6th hour and He was thirsty, so He went to the woman at the well..

I'll be back. I apologise this thread has gotten off track. And I apologise for my contribution to that. But we can move forward and cast these things behind us

Selah, you are kidding yourself when you write that. No one that "loves me" would put in print what you did. I know God loves me and there is no need for Him to "call me back into His Gospel" as I never left.

You would be better served if you looked inside yourself instead of attempting to tell others what they should do. It would be difficult for another to take advice from one that shows the traits you are now showing.

Hypocrite

Good morning sweet pea.

I suddenly have a loss of appetite

Anyone have any "Tums" ?

Whirlwind,

I tried to offer you a peace & love offer or a truce; you rejected it and scoffed. Second I shrugged and said to myself "she'll come around" But rather than remaining silent, you have continued to promote your bitterness around the forum and I'm not ignorant to you devices.

So first; I am going to give you the defintion of slander and let you decide who is slandering (and this would be the very first time I've ever in my life been accused of this and also the first time I've even uttered/written the word)

Slander:
A type of defamation. Slander is an untruthful oral (spoken) statement about a person that harms the person's reputation or standing in the community. Because slander is a tort (a civil wrong), the injured person can bring a lawsuit against the person who made the false statement. If the statement is made via broadcast media -- for example, over the radio or on TV -- it is considered libel, rather than slander, because the statement has the potential to reach a very wide audience.

Did you get that? *Slander* is an UNTRUTHFUL oral (spoken) statement-which evidentally get's some folks a day in court! Nothing I've produced in this forum regarding you is slanderous it is all TRUTH.




(Well you my lady just did exactly what you accused me of) you have no substantial evidence to prove at all that I'm hate filled.


I'm very much in Yahshua, so if you do not see Him, you might want to sincerely consider what is wrong with your eyes.
And I guess once wasn't enough, you had to accuse me of slander twice? What baggage, I carry my Bible and that is all. So now you're calling the Bible baggage that needs to be dumped. I'd bridle your tongue if I were you and remove the scales from your eyes as well.



Very good Scripture. And even the part you over-sized. You ought to heed it and dump the serpent seed teaching and keep it outside where it belongs.



Do I need to give you the definition of "accuse"? If by my defending the Holy Word makes you offended and feel as though you're being accused, you might want to humble yourself. Yes you repeatedly asked me to produce Scripture and I "repeatedly" gave it but you just ignored it every time. Go figure.


What?



OK. I'm guessing this is a threat or a test?



Threat, OK. Yes sir.



Since you asked. See below, dated March 26 2008 in the thread titled "sex in the garden". I also saw a few people trying to show you the truth in that thread...you ignored them as well.



I'm actually quite baffled that you used false doctrine/gospel to defend a false doctrine and hardly anyone in that thread noticed!!! But I'm more concerned that you also exalted it above the Word of Truth; notice the last sentence of yours? And even your wording, you knew it was false, produced it anyway and then used it as if it were truth? That is Babylon!

Revelation 18:4
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.



The doctrine of the serpent seed, makes you very consistent with Murray and others of that nature. Otherwise...where else did you get it? Thin air?



You ask a lot. That might take me some time. Or you could just go back over the thread where we were discussing, paying attention to what I was really trying to tell you, show you, give you, do for you.



Let's see now; slanderer, accuser, hate filled, not a lady, and now I'm a nitwit, which
means : a scatterbrained or stupid person. You want to tell me I'm fat and ugly too? I'll go ahead and allow you to use me as your personal name calling bag and in the meantime..I'll continue to pray for you and forgive you.



Judi, you need someone like yesterday! You're on a dangerous road to destruction. And I'm willing to take a fine tuned guess, it all is coming from what you are teaching, it has become a "Serpent Stone" for you, and the more you cling to it and believe, the more the truth you had is covered up in you by the lies. Not to mention what that teaching itself is causing in you, how you reacted to me in this thread alone is evident. You know as well as I do that we're all sinners, none of us are perfectly walking in Yahshua *yet* but you ought to atleast know the basics of how to deal with 1: an enemy and 2: A person who is really trying to get you out of the pit.

I apologise for having to answer your threats. But you left me no choice. Next time, accept a loving truce offer and move on.
Regard,
Selah

Oh and this is a WARNING from the one who CREATED Adam and EVE:

Genesis 4:15
And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him.

So I would suggest you forgive Cain and cease from your slandering accusations about him. You are treading on dangerous ground

Not to mention: This is Cain's first born
Genesis 5:21
And Enoch lived sixty and five years, and begat Methuselah:

Genesis 5:22
And Enoch walked with God after he begat Methuselah three hundred years, and begat sons and daughters:

I do not expect to come into this forum daily and see name calling, however, daily it exist.

So I say I love you Selah, I love you Mysteryman, I love you Whirlwind :







http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name-calling
Name calling is a phenomenon studied by a variety of academic disciplines from anthropology, to child psychology, to politics. It is also studied by rhetoricicians, and a variety of other disciplines that study propaganda techniques and their causes and effects. The technique is most frequently employed within political discourse.


[] As a cognitive bias

Name calling is both a logical fallacy and cognitive bias, and a technique to promote propaganda. Propagandists use the name-calling technique to incite fears and arouse prejudices with the intent that invoked fear based on fearmongering tactics will encourage those that read, see or hear propaganda to construct a negative opinion about a person, group, or set of beliefs or ideas that the propagandist would wish the recipients to denounce. The method is intended to provoke conclusions and actions about a matter apart from an impartial examinations of the facts of the matter. When employed, name-calling is thus a substitute for rational, fact-based arguments against an idea or belief, based upon its own merits]]

Selah, please refer to Cain's genealogy, which is not in that of Adam for a reason...Adam is not his father. When you do you will see similarites in the names of Cain's offspring and those of Adam. The Enoch that "walked with God" was not the Enoch of Cain. Not only that but you will also notice there are MANY, MANY years separating the two Enochs.

As far as placing a mark on Cain....why would that be? I believe it is so we recognize not only Cain but his offspring. God didn't want him killed...why? Because he was the father of the tares and we aren't to kill them...but we are to know them.

Matthew 13:38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

He and his offspring have a job to do...all part of God's great plan. The mark is so we know him, not forgive him.

As I was reading down through this thread, I saw "Christ IN" one of the posters. I don't think you all need me to tell you as to whom I am speaking