Part P - Shocking surprise
By whom will you be persecuted for the truth?

In the time of the end, during the early stages of trouble, when the four winds of strife are released and part of the earth and third of its inhabitants are destroyed, many churches remain in lukewarm Laodicean condition because they are lacking three essential requirements to salvation - genuine faith, Christ righteousness and the Holy Spirit. (See Part N). Large number of Christian believers remain worldly because the Spirit of God is not in them. Many churches remain spiritually destitute because they have accepted some devil’s deceptions and teach them as if they were God’s truth. They lack the genuine faith in God’s word. Majority of their members during that time will remain in these spiritless churches even after God’s call to come out of them.
Rev 18:4: Then I heard another voice from heaven say: "Come out of her, my people, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues;
This post examines why in the time of the end God is calling His people to come out of the churches. It will identify some of devil’s counterfeits that are being taught already today and will be taught still by many churches as gospel truth before and during coming persecution. Teaching deceptions as the truth will be the main reason why God’s people will be called to come out of them.

Part P:
During the existence of mankind, the enemy of God sneaked into Christian teaching three major lies, believed by the majority of Christian churches today as the truth. The first lie was presented to mankind right on the beginning, in the garden of Eden. The second one, found its way to our teaching in the first few centuries of Christianity. Finally the third one, was introduced not so long ago - just in the past two hundred years or so. Together, these three lies, in the time of the end, are pivotal in deceiving the world as well as a large portion of Christianity. There are other deceptions being taught in churches in these days as the truth, but none with such a devastating consequences as the three, here mentioned. This post exposes them for what they really are.

Lie No. 1: When you die you shall not die:
The most prevalent deception accepted in Christian churches today as the truth, is belief that when person dies, he/she does not die completely, but something of that person keeps on living even after the death. Many Christian churches believe, that when their spirit departs, their conscience or soul departs with it as well, and is present and somehow alive with God. This is the biggest lie that the devil has successfully perpetrated on mankind, right from the beginning of man’s existence in the garden of Eden.
The main cause why this deception is so widely accepted today by so many churches as the truth, is the lack of understanding on the part of Christian church leaders, what the soul is and what the spirit in man is, what it consists of, and what is its purpose. Majority of churches, thanks to the spiritual ignorance of their leaders, believe and teach the devil’s first lie as the truth. For better understanding of the word “spirit” in all its forms see one future post. Here, we will examine only the spirit which is in every one of us.
When God created man, He made him from two components:
Gen.2:7 the LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being. (Living being = living soul)
First component was the body, which He made from the substances (materials) found on earth.
The second component was the breath of life. What is the breath of life?
Job 31:8: But it is the spirit in a man, the breath of the Almighty, that gives him understanding.
The answer is clear. The breath of life is the spirit in a man. When this breath of life (or spirit) is combined with body, man becomes a living soul or living being. Both components are needed. In other words the spirit or breath of life is not some entity, but only a life giving force or life giving power. If we consider a DVD recorder as a body, then this body needs a battery or some kind of juice (power) to become active. Same way the body needs the breath of life (the spirit) to become alive! When the spirit departs man becomes a dead being or dead soul. We call it today corpse or cadaver.
But that is not all! This spirit (or breath of life) which God gave, carries also a capacity for a man to become intelligent and emotional creature.
Job 31:8: But it is the spirit in a man, the breath of the Almighty, that gives him understanding.
This life giving power (the spirit or breath of life) makes it possible for us, by growing up into maturity, to become thinking, reasoning and feeling creatures. Animals spirits don’t have this capacity. When person is conceived the spirit in that soon to be person as well as his mind is void - empty of thought and emotion - at this stage the brain and consequently the mind which the brain houses is nonexistent. The soon to be developed embryo is only charged with life giving power (with the breath of life or in other words with the spirit void of any feelings or thought). When the person is born, the mind of a new born almost immediately starts absorbing like a sponge everything around him with the senses available to him at that moment. Soon all his senses (sight, touch, smell, taste, hearing) are involved in shaping his own mind. From that same moment, when the mind starts absorbing everything around, the spirit which is in every person, is being molded according to how his own mind is being shaped. In other words, from the moment a person is born, the spirit in each and every person is irreversibly connected with his/her own mind. During the life, they cannot be separated. We can claim, that from the moment a person is born the spirit of a man and his mind become one and the same. It makes perfect sense that they become the same, since it is the spirit which is responsible for our capacity to become intelligent and emotional creatures. When we grow little bit more mature, thanks to our brain, which is part of the body, we can process all information and stimuli coming to us through these senses (sight, hearing, smell, taste, touch) and form our own thoughts and feelings. These we then record in our mind as memories. Through all of above we form our habits and are molding our own character. This is done throughout the life of each person. As the mind in a person changes, so does his spirit.
When a person dies, the brain which was part of the body dies as well. With the brain die also all our thoughts and feelings, as well as, all our senses. In other words, with the brain dies our mind as well.
Psa.146:4: His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth, in that very day his thoughts perish. (KJV)
Eccl.12:7: “... and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.”
The life giving force (the spirit) returns then back to God. This force (breath of life which was in the man) carries back to God also the exact stamp or imprint of that person’s mind. It carries back the exact imprint simply because throughout the life it was irreversibly connected with it. But by itself this breath of life (spirit) is not alive and never can be. It is only some kind of force or power which can give life to what gets connected with it.. It needs to be connected to a body, to make the body alive.
Eccl.9:10: Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might, for in the grave, where you are going, there is neither working nor planing nor knowledge nor wisdom.
Imagine the DVD recorder again as a body. But instead of a battery to power the recorder you receive a blank disc (breath of life - the spirit) which acts both ways - as a power giving source (life giving source), as well as a recording disc (capacity to form thoughts, feelings and make memories). Throughout the life of the recorder, it records everything on that disc till the energy is depleted and or the recorder breaks down. When the recorder grows old and the life ebbs away, the disc is recorded full and the energy is drained. The recorder is worn out and the person dies. But the disc (the breath of life - the spirit) now full of the person’s life recording, returns back to God who gave it. For this disc (spirit) which returned to God to become active again and be able to play these thoughts, feelings and memories and make new ones, it is necessary that God would provide new recorder with that same recorded disc.
Same way, for a dead person to become alive, and start to think and plan all over again, God must provide a new body (spiritual) and again the breath of life (spirit), this time, however, with that person’s previous imprint of his mind. Only then, can the same person become alive again. In the two different resurrections it works as follows:
1) Resurrection of the just:
When Jesus comes and raises believers (who have accepted Jesus as their savior) from the graves, God supplies new body (this time spiritual body) and provides again the breath of life (the spirit) with the same imprint of that person’s mind but with deleted all shortcomings and deficiencies that person had. They will be replaced. Instead of them Christ righteousness and holiness is provided to believers to fill the gaps and deficiencies of their character and conduct. This way everyone will be holy and will be able to remain in the presence of holy God for eternity to come. (Please understand that this is only a simplified version of the process).
2) Resurrection of the damned:
On the end at the white throne judgment, everyone else is raised up. What kind of bodies God will supply, Bible does not mention. However, the breath of life (the spirit) is returned to them with all the deficiencies and shortcomings they had before. The sin remains in them. Everyone is then judged for what they have done. Those who were found guilty (names of those not found written in the book of life) are destroyed in the lake of fire.

Today, millions of Christian believers are convinced that their departed loved ones are in blissful happiness with Jesus in heaven, while in reality they are all dead and are still in their graves (excluding few exceptions), waiting for the resurrection.
Acts 2:29: Brothers, I can tell you confidently that the patriarch David died and was buried, and his tomb is here to this day. ...
Verse 34: For David did not ascend to heaven ....
If the souls of dead believers are living with Jesus in heaven, why would Jesus have to come back to this earth to raise the dead saints from their graves? Aren’t they with Jesus? If all dead saints are in some kind of spirit form living with Jesus in heaven, why would there be need for any resurrection?

Rev 20:4-6: I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received his mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection.

Why was, and still is, this lie that when you die you shall not really die so widely propagated among millions of believers? The importance of this deception became truly apparent, just in the last few decades. Thanks to our progress in medicine and in the science and technology, in the past 30 years or so, we have suddenly thousands upon thousands of people claiming that they came from the other side of the grave, where they have visited their loved ones for a few moments or a few minutes, while they were dead. When modern medical procedures brought them back to life, these resuscitated people brought with them their own experiences from the other side as well. That would be a truly good news, if they were really truth. But notice what message the vast majority of them brought back!
1) Maybe not by words, but by their visual experience practically all of them claim, that almost everyone of their departed loved ones are in heaven, and thus implying that most of us living, no mater what we do, will be in heaven eventually also. But the Bible claims something totally different..
Mat.7:13-14: Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.
2) The importance of Jesus’ sacrifice for the salvation of man is by the visitors to the other side almost totally ignored and seldom if ever mentioned. But the Bible gives credit to no one else, but to Jesus, over and over again.
Acts 4:12: “Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.”
3) To cloak the lack of biblical support for these experiences, overall importance is given to humanistic philosophy of life.
I do not claim to understand all the aspects and reasons behind all this, in fact, I understand it little, but it is obvious to me, that this deception is playacted on all of us on a global scale for one main reason only:

To sow a doubt in God’s word - the Bible.

While God proclaimed in Gen.2:17: ... “for when you eat of it you will surely die.”
The serpent proclaimed in Gen.3:4: ... “you will not surely die”
It boils down simply whom we will believe more; God or the devil? Everyone of us has to decide for self. As far as it goes for me personally, I give more credence to God and the Bible than to anyone or anything else.

What about you?
* * * * * * * *

Lie No. 2: Last vs. first - Sabbath versus Sunday!
Almost all Christian world celebrates Sunday as the Lord’s day. Majority of Christians go to churches and worship God on this day and many of them keep it holy. In this chapter, I will not attempt to prove to you which day is truly the Lord’s day. Just by reading your Bible and familiarizing self with its content, the Bible makes it abundantly clear to every believer, which day God Himself considers holy, and on which day He expects us to worship Him. The real question that should be asked instead is:

What do you really want to be - a Bible believer or a church believer?
Whom do you really wish to follow - God’s counsel, or man’s advise or simply just your own?

When you truly in you heart answer these questions to yourself, and decide which road you will take, then hopefully you will be able to live also with the consequences of your decisions. Each of us will have to give account to God, not for what your pastor or priest said or advised you, but for what you have done. Therefore everyone of you should choose very carefully!
In this chapter I would only like to show you the consequences of some decisions made in the past by people portrayed in the Bible. They were told by God what to do, same way as God told us on which day to worship Him, and what day to keep holy. But somehow in their minds they figured out that they would honor God better, if they did it their own way, rather than how God instructed them. Same way today millions of Christians believe, that they honor God more if they will worship Him on Sunday (because Sunday’s resurrection of Jesus?), rather than on the Sabbath as God instructed us.
Before we start, I would like to mention about God’s one characteristic trait I have not commented on or covered in these studies. The God of the Bible is very particular God. He doesn’t like to show off with His power, and neither is He trying to overwhelm us with His might. He is reserved and speaks seldom. But all what He says, He also means. Ignoring His instructions always (sooner or later) and I repeat always carries consequences. Here is one Bible example, it is found in 1 Samuel ch.15.
The Lord instructed King Saul to totally destroy the Amalekites. Everyone was to be put to death - men, women, children, even the infants. All their animals were to be slaughtered as well. Saul went and did as the Lord instructed him. He killed everyone and everything except he spared the life of the king Agag and the best of the sheep and cattle. Saul partly did this with good intentions. He spared them so they could sacrifice them to the Lord his God. Saul only wanted give honor to God for their victory. Was God pleased with Saul and with what he did?
1 Sam.15:23: ... “Because you have rejected the word of the Lord, he has rejected you as a king.”
Honestly, now you tell me, how much difference is there in what vast majority of Christian believers are doing today?
The Lord our God clearly instructed us:
Exo.20:8: “Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy.” ...
With good intentions, majority of Christian believers are choosing to remember Sunday to keep holy. Will God be pleased with the millions of believers ignoring His instructions and doing rather their own thing? Or is it suddenly acceptable to God, because not one, but millions are doing it? Each of you have to answer these questions for yourself in your heart.

All Christian believers claim that they love Jesus. But what does Jesus have to say about our love for Him?
John 14:15: "If you love me, you will obey what I command.
What exactly did Jesus command us to do?
John 15:12: My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you.
Each person may have different idea how to express love for others. For some it can become so horrible and twisted that I have even read somewhere that one murderer was killing people because he loved them. Since everyone can come up with a different idea what love for the neighbor means, God has not left it to our own discretion.
Rom 13:9: The commandments, "Do not commit adultery," "Do not murder," "Do not steal," "Do not covet," and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: "Love your neighbor as yourself."
We are not left in dark how to express our love for each other. The last six commandments spell it for us point by point.

Exo 20:12: "Honor your father and your mother... - deals with respect for others.
Exo 20:13: "You shall not murder. - deals with intensional harm to others.
Exo 20:14: "You shall not commit adultery. - deals with fidelity.
Exo 20:15: "You shall not steal. - deals with honesty.
Exo 20:16: "You shall not give false testimony against your neighbor. - deals with deceit.
Exo 20:17: "You shall not covet .... - deals with avarice, lust and greed.
If we love someone, we will not deliberately do to him or her any of the above.

Our expression of love for God is very similar. If we claim that we love Jesus, we would not want to do something hurtful or disappointing to Him or to God. How do we express our love for God and Jesus Christ? Again, God has not left us in the dark. The first four commandments are summing it up.
Since God is not a person whom we could by some deliberate action defraud, murder, steal from or abuse, the love for God is expressed in our mental attitude toward Him.

Exo 20:3: "You shall have no other gods before me.- deals with priorities.
The world in general and also some churches with portion of Christian believers who go there, have made money (material wealth) and power their true god. Some Ministries have amassed riches for themselves on promises of wealth and prosperity. No wonder some go to church in hope to get rich. Monetary wealth, power or fame are often the most important things in many believers lives. When God and knowing Him and Jesus Christ will become your most important goal in your life, then God will impart you with His Spirit and will lead you to get to know Him well. Search your heart and see what are your priorities in your life?

Exo 20:4-5: "You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; ... - deals with imagination.
By making a statue or a form or even a picture of something and imagining that it represents God, we degrade God to human level. When we pray or bow down to these statues, even so we may only visualize them as a channel or medium to God, we are doing nothing else but in ignorance worshiping idols. Some churches are full of holy statues. Are you one of their members? These institutions will not change, but if you wish to serve true God in all your sincerity, will you continue to prey and bow down to them? Be careful of how and what you think about God. God desires that we would communicate (pray) in our minds with His Spirit, not with wood or stone.

Exo 20:7: "You shall not misuse the name of the LORD your God, for the LORD will not hold anyone guiltless who misuses his name. - deals with reverence.
In these days many churches have cheapened God’s name and His word to a common level. Preachers don’t hold His name in awe, rather they have made the churches and their sermons some kind of entertainment show and a place for jokes and laughter. God Himself sternly warns of the consequences. If you hear sermons where jokes and laughter are used by pastors to entertain rather than to teach, they are misusing God’s name, and for your own spiritual well-being, get out of there fast. Don’t give assent to popular entertainment ridiculing God. That will not hurt God, but it will surely destroy you.

Exo 20:8-11: "Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. ..... For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy. - deals with acknowledgment.
By worshiping on and keeping holy the Sabbath day, we are recognizing God as the Creator of everything and we are acknowledging His dominion (rule) over everything, including us. By worshiping and keeping holy (knowingly or unknowingly) any other day except the Sabbath, we are demonstrating to the world around us, to God and to the whole heavenly realm as well, that His dominion (rule) over us is not needed or even wanted. The teaching of evolution in Christian countries is the direct result of almost the whole Christian world disregarding the Sabbath day and choosing instead another day to worship Him. Majority of Christians confess with their mouth that He is the Creator, but by their actions they proclaim the opposite. God Himself declared that there is only one way to demonstrate to Him and to everyone else if we are truly willing to acknowledge Him as our Creator:

Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy.

Same as it was with loving your neighbor, it is with loving God. It becomes obvious that if we love God and Jesus Christ we will not deliberately do things mentioned above. The Bible makes it clear: If we love God and Jesus Christ, we will obey His commandments from gratitude and love.
If we don’t love Him, we won’t obey them
John 14:24: He who does not love me will not obey my teaching.
How many Christians express their true love for God by practicing all four of them? When you eliminate pretenders who are mainly seeking material blessing through their religion, when you pass by all who bow down to statues, kiss their stony feet and pray to them or through them, when you disregard all those who come to hear the word of God to be entertained rather then to have their hearts convicted and stricken and when you disavow all who are refusing publically to acknowledge their Creator and God by turning their feet from Sabbath, how many true believers do you have left? And that is only our attitude toward God. Then add to that all the greedy, those who lie and cheat and so on. In just a few years, in the time of the end, to many Jesus Himself will say:
Mat 7:23: Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'
The reason why they will be told that, was explained in this study.
From all this, any wise person can understand that in the end, not every so called Christian will be a true Christian, neither every so called believer will be a true believer and not every worshiper will be God worshiper.
Mat 7:21-22: "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?'
What will you do? The choice is yours!




Lie No. 3: Rapture - Before the end woes come, believers are snatched to Jesus.
As a matter of fact, the word “rapture” is not even mentioned in the Bible. The doctrine of the rapture was unheard, till approximately 200 years ago. The main reason why it is so popular today, is realization of many believers that truly Bible claims, that in the time of the end, the whole world will be deceived. Since there is roughly 2 billion Christian believers living presently, surely it’s not possible for them to be deceived together with the remaining world. The only acceptable answer for the world-wide deception is, that they will not be here. They must be snatched away first, so the rest of the world can be deceived after.
These almost 2 billion Christian believers do not realize, that most of them are deceived already today together with the rest of the world. How many churches believe that the soul or spirit of the person lives after that person dies? How many churches believe that Sunday is the Lord’s day? No wonder that these same churches believe, that they will be raptured and spared persecution. Today, majority of Christian believers simply believe only what is convenient for them. And the fault for all this, lays solely with their church leaders.
Isa.3:13-14: The Lord takes his place in court; he raises to judge the people. The Lord enters into judgment against the elders and leaders of his people: “It is you who have ruined my vineyard; the plunder from the poor is in your houses.”

The true faith of every believer is composed of having trust and confidence in God and Jesus Christ. It is knowing and having confidence in God’s character, His principles and His plans. All three aspects are essential for successful Christian living. Without them your faith is dead or if not completely dead, then crippled or at least incomplete.
Notice that the devil’s three major lies are directed precisely at these three aspects of your faith.

The first lie, that when you die your soul shall not actually die, is aimed at God’s character. It basically suggests that God is a liar and therefore untrustworthy. How many Christians by their belief give consent to this lie?

The second lie, that Sunday is the Lord’s day and should be kept holy is directed at God’s principles. It suggests that God’s principles (commandments) and His word are unimportant and are not binding. How many Christians every Sunday manifest their disregard of God’s Law or His word?

Finally, the third lie attacks God’s plans for us and also for the end. Christian believers have nothing to worry about, because they are convinced that they will be snatched and in the time of persecution won’t be here. Why study and search for God’s end-time plans, when all of them will be raptured away?

No wonder that only 144 000 believers will see through these lies before the end commences. They will distance themselves from these churches and will become God’s servants in the time of the end. (See Part O). Christian world overall will remain deceived. Some believers will eventually side with the 144 000 and will become the remnant. The rest of the believers, thanks to adhering to one or more of these three lies, will stay deceived till the end.

There are two main Biblical reasons why the rapture of churches is not possible. Here they are:
First:
1 Pet 1:15-16: But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; for it is written: "Be holy, because I am holy."
Heb 12:14: Make every effort to live in peace with all men and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord.
Majority supporters of rapture are either ignorant or totally disregard this very important fact:
For anyone to be raptured, snatched away or changed in the blink of an eye into their immortal bodies without experiencing death, that person or persons must prior to their transformation reflect fully the character of God and Jesus Christ in their lives. To put it in a different way, they must be absolutely holy, or in other words they must have Father’s name and Jesus’ name written on their foreheads. Only in that condition they can be transformed without experiencing death and not be destroyed by the brightness and presence of holy God, because anything even a little sinful is in the presence of God consumed. Bible claims that only the 144 000 reach this state of holiness. That is why the Bible identifies them as those, who had his name and his Father's name written on their foreheads. (See also Part O)
The rest of us sinful folks who have accepted Jesus as our savior must go first through the death, where all our deficiencies and shortcomings can be left behind. When we are raised from death in our appointed time, these flaws in our character and conduct remain in grave and God through the Holy Spirit supplies Christ holiness and righteousness to all of us where we have lacked. Only then all of us will be holy and will be able to remain in the presence of holy God without being burned up. But this God’s plan of transforming us into a full state of holiness would be a subject for a different study.
Understanding of this fundamental prerequisite of need for holiness of every person who will stay in the presence of holy God in heavenly realm or on the new earth without being consumed, and how the Lord through death makes it possible for believers to be holly, makes the theory of rapture of the churches plain and obvious counterfeit of devil.
Satan is just taking advantage of your ignorance and lack of understanding of God’s plans and principles.

Second:
Exactly when are God’s servants changed?
1 Cor.15:51-52: Listen, I will tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed - in a flash, in a twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.
Notice that all this is happening at the last trumpet. When will the last trumpet sound?
Rev.11:15: The seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, which said: "The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign for ever and ever."
In the previous posts we have learned that the last - seventh trumpet represents third woe, which is the wrath of God demonstrated in pouring out the seven last plagues. It is therefore at this time at the earliest, when the seven last plagues are poured out, when the believers can be changed and caught up with Jesus.
Even more precisely when the last trumpet will sound, is described in:
Mat.24:31: And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
Now we have obtained precise moment when the so called “rapture” will take place. We have already learned that under the seventh trumpet were portrayed seven last plagues. Here we have learned that this last - seventh trumpet will sound not on the beginning of these seven last plagues, but rather on their end. It is at that time, when Jesus is coming and gathers His people to Himself. All this is happening under the seventh seal when heaven is silent. God’s angels are doing the gathering. Heaven is most likely empty.
You have been presented here with Biblical proof that so called “rapture” is not really a rapture but rather a gathering of God’s people (dead as well as alive) to Jesus at Jesus’ coming on the end.

Another part of the Scriptures support this conclusion in its entirety:
1 Th.4:15-17: According to the Lord’s own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.
Beside fully supporting the above conclusion, that all this happens all way on the end, verse 17 implies something else, but for us here, very important. The words - “After that, we who are still alive and are left” suggest that on the end, when Jesus returns, there will not be many believers who will be left alive.
Why most of God’s people will be killed we can read in:
Rev.13:7:He was given power to make war against the saints and to conquer them
Rev.13:15: He was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that it could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed.
The faith of the true believers will be severely tested in the time of the end. Those willing to compromise on any point of truth will join the enemy ranks.
Why Christian churches are not raptured before the end time trouble starts, is also obvious from the following verses:
Rev.14:3-4: And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth. These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb.
To be offered as the firstfruits, you really must be the first fruit and not the last. If church believers were snatched to God on the beginning, as is usually believed, then these 144 000 must be the last fruit or at least the later fruit, but certainly not the first. (For more details see previous post - Part O) Verse three gives you an idea who precisely is redeemed and how many of them.
The immediately following sentence provides evidence that they were not part of any church or churches. (These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure.)
Another indirect evidence that none of the Christian churches are snatched to Christ is in the message to the church of Laodicea
Rev.3:16-17: So, because you are lukewarm--neither hot nor cold--I am about to spit you out of my mouth. You say, 'I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.' But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked.
This message is directed to Christian churches just before Jesus’ coming. It informs us, in what kind of spiritual condition all churches presently are. Unless they wake up and change, they will be rejected by Jesus (I am about to spit you out of my mouth).

Only one question remains to be answered:
Will the churches in the end change or will they remain the same and be eventually turned down by Jesus?
Rev.18:2;4: ... "Fallen! Fallen is Babylon the Great! She has become a home for demons and a haunt for every evil spirit, a haunt for every unclean and detestable bird. .... "Come out of her, my people, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues;
Revelation chapter 17 then explains, that the name “Babylon” is given to a woman - who became the great prostitute, siting on many waters.
Rev.17:18: The woman you saw is the great city that rules over the kings of the earth."
The word “woman” symbolize a city and also the church. (Read Rev.ch.12).
Many waters represent:
Rev.17:15: ...."The waters you saw, where the prostitute sits, are peoples, multitudes, nations and languages.
The book of Revelation provides sufficient evidence that in the end, many Christian churches were rejected by Jesus. Thanks to the lies and deceptions which are already in the churches today, many denominations end up worshiping the wrong God. That is why the prophet was so greatly astonished when he saw it.
Rev.17:6: I saw that the woman was drunk with the blood of the saints, the blood of those who bore testimony to Jesus. When I saw her, I was greatly astonished.
It may be a shock to many believers today as well.
Just imagine:

Many so called Christian churches will be in the time of the end instrumental in killing God’s people.

The fact of being deceived by the three above mentioned counterfeits is one of the reasons, why so many lukewarm believers will end up worshiping in the time of the end the wrong God. The other reason why they end up on the wrong side is their lack of trust in God’s word alone. They are not capable to digest solid spiritual food because they liked fables for so long that they cannot distinguish any more lie from the truth. Just by reading various posts on this web site a truly mature Christian believer can observe that a number of participants on this forum are not able to accept a sound doctrine.
2 Tim 4:3: For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
To many the truth of God’s word is inconvenient and they will refuse to hear it.
2 Th 2:10: . . . . They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.

By understanding the subject of 144 000 servants of God and the condition of Laodicean church, the Scriptures are exposing another counterfeit of Satan intended to lead Christians astray. While Bible is claiming that a great number of believers in the time of the end will have to give up their lives for the faith they profess, the devil is offering to believers the rapture theory of the churches, as the easier and more convenient alternative.

Revelation A to Z - Part P
Your friend in Jesus
HH

Hi HH .. where? may I ask does

2 Cor 5:8
We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

and

Colossians 2:16
Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days

fit into this teaching?

To HeIsFaithful:

Second Corinthians chapters four and five are highly symbolic. As we have died with Christ (symbolically), yet we live, so we are also alive with Christ (symbolically), even if some of us have already died. If we live presently in these mortal bodies, we are separated from Christ (we are away from the Lord). But if we die, the Holy Spirit which God gave us as a deposit or guarantee and which is now in us, is then again reunited with Jesus (so in death we are reunited with Christ) and the Holy Spirit which was in us, stays with Jesus till our resurrection from death at Jesus coming. So this way we live with Christ through the Holy Spirit which cannot die, even so we died.

Spirit filled person prefers to be with Jesus. In death it is but a moment and you are with Christ. (In death time does not exist), so Paul is saying that he prefers to be away from the body and rather be with Christ. But even today same as David, Paul is in the grave and both are waiting for the resurrection. For us, living, thousands of years may pass, but for the dead it is less than blink of an eye. That is the time paradox between the living and the dead. ( Again subject for a different study, it will be little bit explained in Part R).

Please notice that the Holy Spirit which God gave to those who believe, is not the spirit or the breath of life which is given to man to become living soul or living being. They are two different forces. I think it will be Part R which will explain this more in details.

In summary: Paul is speaking about preference to be out of body (dead) and to be present with Christ in Spirit or through the Holy Spirit. When believer dies, the Holy Spirit which was in that believer is now with Christ, so spiritually the believer is with Christ even in his death.
That is why the Holy Spirit is the deposit or guarantee that all of us will be eventually with Jesus in glorified bodies also. When? At the resurrection.


Col 2:16: Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.

1) What you eat or drink - see Deut. Ch 14 - part of ceremonial laws of OT.
2) Religious festivals - example 7 days Tabernacles - part of ceremonial laws of OT.
3) New Moon celebration - see Lev. - part of ceremonial laws of OT.
4) Sabbath day - beside regular every seventh day Sabbath, Israel celebrated every year several special Sabbath days, regardless on what day they occurred. Some of these were: Passover, Unleavened bread, Feast of Trumpets, Day of Atonement and other. Again these Sabbath days were part of ceremonial laws of OT. The above verse pertains to these special Sabbath days and not to regular seventh day Sabbath.

The evidence that it is so is in the next verse:
Col 2:17: These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.
The ceremonial laws of the Old Testament are here presented as shadow of the things, because they symbolically depicted the coming of Christ. Therefore all these ceremonies were fulfilled in coming of Christ. To insist on observing any of them is a failure to recognize that they were already fulfilled.

Verse 14 makes it clear:
Col 2:14: having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. (KJV may make it even clearer.)

Same thing is written in:
Eph 2:14-15: For he himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace, (again KJV may make it clearer.)
Jew and Gentile are now one. Jesus abolished the ceremonial laws and regulations.

It is important to distinguish between the two sets of laws. One was written by God on the tablets of stone and placed inside the ark - this is the everlasting Law, it is summing up God’s principles and character, it will never change.

The second set of laws was written by Moses on scrolls and placed on the side of the ark (not inside). These were called ceremonial laws which pointed to Jesus and were in effect only till coming of Christ. These ceremonial laws Jesus nailed to the cross.
Deu 31:24-26: After Moses finished writing in a book the words of this law from beginning to end, he gave this command to the Levites who carried the ark of the covenant of the LORD: "Take this Book of the Law and place it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God. There it will remain as a witness against you.

Believer has to distinguish between the temporal and eternal.
Mat 5:17-18: "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.
In Col. Bible claims that Jesus abolished the law, while in Mat. Jesus claims that it remains. For many it may pose a problem till they realize that there are two sets of laws. One eternal and one temporal. The temporal was already fulfilled and by Jesus abolished.

Just consider this:

Is it alright today to have as God money or material possessions?
Is it alright today to worship idols instead of God?
Is it alright today to ridicule and curse God?
Is it alright today to ignore the Sabbath?

If on the first three the answer is “NO” why would the fourth one be an exception?

Your friend in Jesus
HH

Hi H. Question. What about the person's spirit that was born of God? There's a difference between the ones who were born of God, and, those who weren't.


Joh 1:13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Joh 8:47 He that is of God heareth God's words:

Thanks!

To researcher: You are correct.

Revelation A to Z - Part R is explaining it in more details. Lord permitting, it will be posted in two weeks.

Your friend in Jesus
HH

Hello Harbinger,

QUOTE

1. I agree about rapture being a lie...a vile lie.

2. To me the Sabbath was the 7th day.....Saturday but ...keeping Sabbath Holy is to keep Christ in your heart at all times. The day no longer matters.

3. I must disagree with your first assertion. You used Acts 2:34 as reference to one not going to heaven upon physical death....

Acts 2:34-35 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, 'The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit Thou on My right hand, Until I make Thy foes Thy footstool.

The subject is David's body, as stated in the preceeding vs.29....let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his speulchre is with us unto this day.

David's flesh body has not nor will ascend. His soul/spirit (our spirit is the intellect of our soul) is immediately with God whether it be on one side of the gulf or the other. I repeat a scripture quoted by He Is Faithful and add another......

2 Corinthians 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Ecclesiastes 12:6-7 Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern. Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God Who gave it.

I believe your attributing being "present with the Lord, once "absent from the body" as being spiritual only isn't correct, other of course, than we are speaking of our spiritual bodies. When we physically die we step out of this flesh shell....same spirit and soul from the first age and we return to our Father. [/b]

To Whirlwind:


If one, let’s say the fourth commandment does not matter, then logically all the remaining nine don’t matter as well. That is what we have around us today - lot of lawlessness.
Book of James is showing what mature Christian should do and what he should become:
James 1:22-25: Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says. Anyone who listens to the word but does not do what it says is like a man who looks at his face in a mirror and, after looking at himself, goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like.
But the man who looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues to do this, not forgetting what he has heard, but doing it--he will be blessed in what he does.
Notice also who are the true God’s people in the time of the end:
Rev.14:12 This calls for patient endurance on the part of the saints who obey God's commandments and remain faithful to Jesus.
Rev.12:17 Then the dragon.. .. went off to make war against.. .those who obey God's commandments and hold to the testimony of Jesus.; ....
I believe that heaven does not give 10% discount on God’s commandments. Maybe you may think that it does give it to you. I am not going to press you. You will have to live with your decision.
My mission and purpose is not to argue, my job is to pass on understanding (as God has given me through the study of His word) to those who seek it and desire it. It is the Holy Spirit in you who will convict you of the truth, not I.
But if something deep down in your mind is causing little doubt or little uncertainty of your present stand and belief on this particular subject, then it is the God’s Spirit in you wooing you to change and to come into harmony with Him.



Bible is here informing us only that David did not ascended into heaven in which ever form - in the body or out of body. The rest speaks about Jesus.


Your quote above and (our spirit is the intellect of our soul) makes our spirit in us immortal.

I perceive confusion in your description what the soul is, what the spirit in man is and what man’s intellect stands for. Bible is giving us the answers in number of different verses. We then have to come to harmonious understanding. Building theories on one verse is dangerous. I know that millions believe same as you do. But that is not guarantee that the world is right. As a matter of fact, because millions believe it, I would be really perturbed.

Your friend in Jesus
HH

Thank you Harbinger....I don't wish to argue either. But, we can discuss can we not?

It is not that I am saying "the fourth commandment doesn't matter." Nor am I saying the Sabbath no longer matters but that the day of the week no longer matters. The Sabbath is Christ....He is in us everyday. We keep the Sabbath every day.

Mark 2:27 And He said unto them, "The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

Sabbath means rest and He became our Rest as He became our Passover. The High Sabbath is Passover and.....

1 Corinthians 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even CHRIST OUR PASSOVER is sacrificed for us:

I don't know what millions of others believe and have never based my beliefs on others. I strive to allow the Holy Spirit to lead me through scripture. I agree with you...."building theories on one verse is dangerous." I gave you two that tell us we are with our Father upon our physical death. Allow me to add another.....

Revelation 22:8 And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet OF THE ANGEL which shewed me these things.

22:9 Then saith he unto me, "See thou do it not: for I AM THY FELLOWSERVANT, and OF THY BRETHREN THE PROPHETS, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God."

There is no confusion HH. When we physically die our soul is with our Father. As the above scripture showed us...this fellowservant, another prophet that had passed before John was in his spiritual body...as we will be upon our physical death.

Thank you for this interesting post.

Gal 2 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law,
but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ,
that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law:
for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

17But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ,
we ourselves also are found sinners,
is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

18For if I build again the things which I destroyed,
I make myself a transgressor.

19For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.

20I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me:
and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me,
and gave himself for me.

21I do not frustrate the grace of God: for

if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Gal 4 9But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God,
how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements,
whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

10Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.

11I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

To John Prewett:

If you will use just little bit of discernment, you will realize that everything you quoted, pertains fully to ceremonial laws which are now abolished. Try to discriminate between the temporal and eternal. Israel obtained two different sets of laws. See this topic or post but read reply #3.

HH

To whirlwind:

Just for your information:


I am sorry to disappoint you, but this fellow servant, is an angel and not another prophet that had passed before John and was in his spiritual body. I would recommend using different translation than just KJV, things may become more clearer to you.

HH

But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees who believed, saying,

It is needful to circumcise them, and to charge them to keep the law of Moses.

And the apostles and the elders were gathered together to consider of this matter.

And when there had been much questioning, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Brethren,
ye know that a good while ago God made choice among you, that by my mouth the Gentiles
should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

And God, who knoweth the heart, bare them witness,
giving them the Holy Spirit, even as he did unto us;
and he made no distinction between us and them,
cleansing their hearts by faith.

Now therefore why make ye trial of God,

that ye should put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples

which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear ?

But we believe that we shall be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus,
in like manner as they.

Acts 15: 5-11

The SDA position on the sabbath is a hoax contrived primarily by E.G. White and the early followers of this organization

Selection of parts of the law for keeping is a methodology of works and the purpose is to capture and retain membership by exclusivity

The problem .... individual salvation of the membership

Salvation is the result of unbending faith in Jesus Christ alone of His willingness and ability to save one for eternity

SDA members attempt to keep their selected laws, which one cannot do consistently, and are told that they must by the leaders of the organization

An SDA member will tell you that they do not know if they are saved, yet the Scriptures tell that one must believe that one is saved unconditionally by the Lord

.... if one does not "believe" in the this truth, then one is not saved

Belief is replaced by works in this case and the organization has miss-led the membership into thinking that one must follow its prescribed and selected laws

The organization has many other off course beliefs, most of which were invented by E.G. White

One major flaw is her idea of the "investigative judgment" the she contrived in order to cover up William Miller's failed attempts to predict the second coming of the Lord

SDAs contend that their organization is the only one that has the correct rendering of Bible prophecy as well

This is definitely not the case for many reasons that can be shown by those who know and understand the scriptures

This kind of behavior reflects the underpinnings of a cult that fronts christianity and anyone who is following should question just what they are doing and move away from it

This doesn't disappoint me at all HH for I am aware this was an angel speaking to John. That is my point. We are the same spirit that God created in the very beginning. This same spirit from before is born of woman, goes through this flesh life and our same spirit (which has never nor will ever die until the white throne judgment) steps out of these flesh shells upon our physical death. In other words....Angels are Us, We are Angels...Flesh body/Spiritual body.

The scripture I quoted tells this to us. The angel speaking to John was...AS WRITTEN...a fellow servant and brethren prophet. Truly, there should be no confusion at all. Angels are us in their spiritual body. That scripture clearly states that the angel was, at one time, a brethren and a prophet. And, to stay with the throught in your original post....this tells us that we do not lay in some hole in the ground upon our physical death. We go to the Father and apparently....we have jobs to do. I find that to be wonderful news.

I would NEVER use another Bible than the KJV. If you are then I can understand your confusion on this issue.

One needs to understand from scripture that angels and humans are not the same creatures, but different

Angelics and humans are always set in contrast to one another as these scriptures tell:

Genesis 19:1 Now the two angels came to Sodom in the evening, and Lot was sitting in the gate of Sodom. When Lot saw [them,] he rose to meet them, and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground.
Genesis 19:15 . When the morning dawned, the angels urged Lot to hurry, saying, "Arise, take your wife and your two daughters who are here, lest you be consumed in the punishment of the city."
Genesis 28:12 Then he dreamed, and behold, a ladder [was] set up on the earth, and its top reached to heaven; and there the angels of God were ascending and descending on it.
Genesis 32:1 So Jacob went on his way, and the angels of God met him.
Job 4:18 If He puts no trust in His servants, [If] He charges His angels with error,
Psalms 8:5 For You have made him a little lower than the angels, And You have crowned him with glory and honor.
Psalms 78:25 Men ate angels' food; He sent them food to the full.
Psalms 78:49 He cast on them the fierceness of His anger, Wrath, indignation, and trouble, By sending angels of destruction [among them.]
Psalms 91:11 For He shall give His angels charge over you, To keep you in all your ways.
Psalms 103:20 Bless the LORD, you His angels, Who excel in strength, who do His word, Heeding the voice of His word.
Psalms 104:4 Who makes His angels spirits, His ministers a flame of fire.
Psalms 148:2 Praise Him, all His angels; Praise Him, all His hosts!
Matthew 4:6 and said to Him, "If You are the Son of God, throw Yourself down. For it is written: 'He shall give His angels charge over you,' and, 'In [their] hands they shall bear you up, Lest you dash your foot against a stone.' "
Matthew 4:11 Then the devil left Him, and behold, angels came and ministered to Him.
Matthew 13:39 "The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels.
Matthew 13:41 "The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice lawlessness,
Matthew 13:49 "So it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come forth, separate the wicked from among the just,
Matthew 16:27 "For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works.
Matthew 18:10 " Take heed that you do not despise one of these little ones, for I say to you that in heaven their angels always see the face of My Father who is in heaven.
Matthew 22:30 "For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven.
Matthew 24:31 "And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Matthew 24:36 " But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only.
Matthew 25:31 " When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory.
Matthew 25:41 "Then He will also say to those on the left hand, 'Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels:
Matthew 26:53 "Or do you think that I cannot now pray to My Father, and He will provide Me with more than twelve legions of angels?
Mark 1:13 And He was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted by Satan, and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered to Him.
Mark 8:38 "For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words in this adulterous and sinful generation, of him the Son of Man also will be ashamed when He comes in the glory of His Father with the holy angels."
Mark 12:25 "For when they rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven.
Mark 13:27 "And then He will send His angels, and gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest part of earth to the farthest part of heaven.
Mark 13:32 " But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.
Luke 2:15 So it was, when the angels had gone away from them into heaven, that the shepherds said to one another, "Let us now go to Bethlehem and see this thing that has come to pass, which the Lord has made known to us."
Luke 4:10 "For it is written: 'He shall give His angels charge over you, To keep you,'
Luke 9:26 "For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words, of him the Son of Man will be ashamed when He comes in His [own] glory, and [in His] Father's, and of the holy angels.
Luke 12:8 " Also I say to you, whoever confesses Me before men, him the Son of Man also will confess before the angels of God.
Luke 12:9 "But he who denies Me before men will be denied before the angels of God.
Luke 15:10 "Likewise, I say to you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents."
Luke 16:22 "So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died and was buried.
Luke 20:36 "nor can they die anymore, for they are equal to the angels and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.
Luke 24:23 "When they did not find His body, they came saying that they had also seen a vision of angels who said He was alive.
John 1:51 And He said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, hereafter you shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of Man."
John 20:12 And she saw two angels in white sitting, one at the head and the other at the feet, where the body of Jesus had lain.
Acts 7:53 "who have received the law by the direction of angels and have not kept [it."]
Romans 8:38 For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come,
1 Cor 4:9 For I think that God has displayed us, the apostles, last, as men condemned to death; for we have been made a spectacle to the world, both to angels and to men.
1 Cor 6:3 Do you not know that we shall judge angels? How much more, things that pertain to this life?
1 Cor 11:10 For this reason the woman ought to have [a symbol of] authority on [her] head, because of the angels.
1 Cor 13:1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.
Galatians 3:19 . What purpose then [does] the law [serve?] It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; [and it was] appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator.
Coloss 2:18 Let no one cheat you of your reward, taking delight in [false] humility and worship of angels, intruding into those things which he has not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,
2 Thess 1:7 and to [give] you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels,
1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifested in the flesh, Justified in the Spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the Gentiles, Believed on in the world, Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 5:21 I charge [you] before God and the Lord Jesus Christ and the elect angels that you observe these things without prejudice, doing nothing with partiality.
Hebrews 1:4 having become so much better than the angels, as He has by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
Hebrews 1:5 For to which of the angels did He ever say: "You are My Son, Today I have begotten You"? And again: "I will be to Him a Father, And He shall be to Me a Son"?
Hebrews 1:6 But when He again brings the firstborn into the world, He says: "Let all the angels of God worship Him."
Hebrews 1:7 And of the angels He says: "Who makes His angels spirits And His ministers a flame of fire."
Hebrews 1:13 But to which of the angels has He ever said: "Sit at My right hand, Till I make Your enemies Your footstool"?
Hebrews 2:2 For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just reward,
Hebrews 2:5 For He has not put the world to come, of which we speak, in subjection to angels.
Hebrews 2:7 You have made him a little lower than the angels; You have crowned him with glory and honor, And set him over the works of Your hands.
Hebrews 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, for the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, that He, by the grace of God, might taste death for everyone.
Hebrews 2:16 For indeed He does not give aid to angels, but He does give aid to the seed of Abraham.
Hebrews 12:22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels,
Hebrews 13:2 Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so [doing] some have unwittingly entertained angels.
1 Peter 1:12 To them it was revealed that, not to themselves, but to us they were ministering the things which now have been reported to you through those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven -- things which angels desire to look into.
1 Peter 3:22 who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him.
2 Peter 2:4 For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast [them] down to hell and delivered [them] into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment;
2 Peter 2:11 whereas angels, who are greater in power and might, do not bring a reviling accusation against them before the Lord.
Jude 1:6 And the angels who did not keep their proper domain, but left their own abode, He has reserved in everlasting chains under darkness for the judgment of the great day;
Revelation 1:20 "The mystery of the seven stars which you saw in My right hand, and the seven golden lampstands: The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands which you saw are the seven churches.
Revelation 3:5 "He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.
Revelation 5:11 Then I looked, and I heard the voice of many angels around the throne, the living creatures, and the elders; and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands,
Revelation 7:1 After these things I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, on the sea, or on any tree.
Revelation 7:2 Then I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God. And he cried with a loud voice to the four angels to whom it was granted to harm the earth and the sea,
Revelation 7:11 All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God,
Revelation 8:2 And I saw the seven angels who stand before God, and to them were given seven trumpets.
Revelation 8:6 So the seven angels who had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound.
Revelation 8:13 And I looked, and I heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, "Woe, woe, woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the remaining blasts of the trumpet of the three angels who are about to sound!"
Revelation 9:14 saying to the sixth angel who had the trumpet, "Release the four angels who are bound at the great river Euphrates."
Revelation 9:15 So the four angels, who had been prepared for the hour and day and month and year, were released to kill a third of mankind.
Revelation 12:7 And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought,
Revelation 12:9 So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
Revelation 14:10 "he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb.
Revelation 15:1 Then I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvelous: seven angels having the seven last plagues, for in them the wrath of God is complete.
Revelation 15:6 And out of the temple came the seven angels having the seven plagues, clothed in pure bright linen, and having their chests girded with golden bands.
Revelation 15:7 Then one of the four living creatures gave to the seven angels seven golden bowls full of the wrath of God who lives forever and ever.
Revelation 15:8 The temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God and from His power, and no one was able to enter the temple till the seven plagues of the seven angels were completed.
Revelation 16:1 Then I heard a loud voice from the temple saying to the seven angels, "Go and pour out the bowls of the wrath of God on the earth."
Revelation 17:1 Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls came and talked with me, saying to me, "Come, I will show you the judgment of the great harlot who sits on many waters,
Revelation 21:9 Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls filled with the seven last plagues came to me and talked with me, saying, "Come, I will show you the bride, the Lamb's wife."
Revelation 21:12 Also she had a great and high wall with twelve gates, and twelve angels at the gates, and names written on them, which are [the names] of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel

Thank you for all the scripture but no where in that are we told angels and humans are "not the same creatures." One is in our spiritual body and one is in our flesh body....same spirit.

creatures are of the Lord's creative acts .... humans and angelics are "created" beings

And it is quite clear that angelics and humans are different and always set in contrast by the scriptures

There is never any implication given in scripture that tells of humans and angelics are the same

You cannot give one scripture that states, or describes that humans are angels as you say .... not one

I already gave one. But...I'll repeat it....

Revelation 22:8 And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet OF THE ANGEL which shewed me these things.

22:9 Then saith he unto me, "See thou do it not: for I AM THY FELLOWSERVANT, and OF THY BRETHREN THE PROPHETS, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God."

To Stephen:

I imagine that you have found out also that every church has some truth, but each church has this truth mixed with errors and deceptions. I guess the SDA is no exception. I agree with you, they teach quite a number of errors. But that is not my point.

Your quote:

I couldn’t agree with you more.

However, as a Christians we have a mirror which we can look into and observe, how close and how much into harmony we are growing with God and Jesus Christ. Comparing self to this mirror, shows our progress into becoming mature Christians.
Eph.4:13: until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.

We cannot stay as we were when we came to Christ. We all must grow, some slower and some faster. How far we progress, that’s what the mirror is for. I hope you realize that the fourth commandment is one part of that mirror consisting of ten segments.
James 1:22-25: Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says. Anyone who listens to the word but does not do what it says is like a man who looks at his face in a mirror and, after looking at himself, goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like. But the man who looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues to do this, not forgetting what he has heard, but doing it--he will be blessed in what he does.

Your friend in Jesus
HH

HH,

Sorry, I must disagree with your idea of sabbath keeping for sure

There is no support for it in scripture, and actually against this idea of placing one day above another for the believer

This parameter was give to national Israel for a purpose ..... if broken. punishable by death

There are many sectors of professing christianity who have taken on the mantle of replacement theology which removes national Israel from end time exegesis

This error has lead to many contrived falsehoods related to the interpretation of the prophetic scriptures

The believer has no position with law keeping .... the law will condemn the attempt to keep

The Lord does not recognize the "work" of sabbath keeping as a contribution

One needs to be totally focused upon the Lord and His only provision for salvation

By grace is one saved through faith, and not of works ........

The believer is then to change one's behavior in this life toward the Lord and toward others

Always "working" to improve and mature in the Lord

Angels are called ministering "spirits". I believe that the soul is seperated from the spirit. Or else there would be no need for Jesus to return and raise those who are asleep in Christ.

After the first resurrection then our souls live on, because we cannot preceed those that died in Christ.
The souls are sealed by the Holy spirit until the day of redemption, salvation etc. Jesus returns and His reward is with Him... The reward is eternity itself.

My 2 cents