The following is an excerpt from my web site "The Writing on the Wall." It was put on the net about 10 years ago. I am quoting it just as a general caution against date setting. As administrator of this forum I want to make it clear what I believe on this subject.

I think some have misunderstood me concerning the Bird Flu article. I did not say that it would begin in the next 6 months, but that based upon a numeric pattern that I was observing then that it appeared so. But I clearly said in that originally article that this numeric about the Bird Flu was just something to ponder and not a sure thing. Since the time that I wrote the article (about a month ago) I have been reminded that the pivotal date of the decree of Nehemiah can be 445 instead of444 BC, and hence a difference of one year is possible to now. Also, the span of time all the way up to 2012 is within range for this Bird Flu to occur and still fit in with the said numeric.

But the fact that the outbreak of the then mystery disease in the Seven Oaks Nursing Home (that killed about 25 people) was first reported on the news the same time that I was reporting my findings about the Bird Flu as it related to the SARS scare here in Toronto, and the fact that the Seven Oaks scare brought the SARS-scare back to memory, and the given the fact that I wrote and posted the topic-post on this forum at the same time the new was breaking the story, which is within 10 miles of where I was posting it --- leads me to believe that the Lord was saying, "Yes, the Bird Flu will fly!" But the timing is still up in the air, (no pun intended!)


Here is my preface to "The Writing on the Wall," which discusses the dating of our Lord's return.

=======================

http://www.1260-1290-days-bible-prophecy.o...ers-intro-b.htm

Bible Prophecy Numbers

Introduction, Part B

Purpose and Scope

To ch. 1a
Back to intro. A


The PURPOSE for writing this book is not to entertain the careless, nor for predicting the future. Bible prophecy numbers are primarily meant to demonstrate that Jesus Christ is the one and only messiah. And, secondarily, prophecy numbers are God's response to the age-old martyrs cry of "How long?" 'How long shall my trial last?' (Revelation 6:9-11).{1}


By super-abundantly exalting the SCOPE and magnitude of these numeric patterns, the Spirit has deliberately placed them far out of the reach of honest men who might otherwise innocently attempt to predict the future with them. For honest men must conclude that, "His paths are past finding out," (Rom.11:33).



It is important that you read the chapters in sequence since there is a building of one brick upon another with increasing glory. For when properly understood, bible prophecy numbers reveal the dimensions of "both the goodness and severity of God," (Rom. 11:22). Its "breadth, and length, and depth, and height," (Eph. 3:18).

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Endnotes:

{1} Just as the timing and nature of the first coming of Christ was misunderstood by the people of that day (John 7), so it shall be again before His Second Coming, to the likely bewilderment of that future end-time people. For this cause, enlightenment is given at this time––so as to supply that future end-time-tribulation-people with a thorough understanding of the many complex time-frames possible, destined to emerge at that time, so that they may have faith and hope to endure it. For by recognizing the various time-periods and patterns in history, this future end-time people will be better equipped to correctly (but never perfectly) apply that knowledge to their own unfolding trial.

We are to know the season, but we will not know the day and the hour.

This follows the tradition of Roshashanan the head of the year and apoximately the next year of Jubalee according to the the Hebrew calendar

Since the day and hour cannot be set till the siting of the new moon over Jeruselem, we cannot know. Those who have studied scripture will be ready.

Probably I'l have dressed for the occation and be washed if at all possible. (if I make it that long)

bananna

10Jesus answered, "A person who has had a bath needs only to wash his feet; his whole body is clean.

John 15:3
You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you.


Math 22
11But when the king came in to view the guests, he looked intently at a man there who had on no wedding garment.

12And he said, Friend, how did you come in here without putting on the [appropriate] wedding garment? And he was speechless (muzzled, gagged).

Ephesians 4:24
And put on the new nature (the regenerate self) created in God's image, [Godlike] in true righteousness and holiness.
Revelation 19:7-9 (King James Version)

7Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.

8And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

9And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

Hi!

Look in the mirror! dew of Israel...you are growing into ...


"...I am like a green fir tree. From me is thy fruit found." Hosea 14:8


Blessings.
Signet

It may not be for us to know...but Issac Newton sure spent his life looking for a date...and he scribbled on date on a margin....I guess he was just speculating...it is interesting to read what he wrote though.

http://www.pretribulation.com/isaac-newton.htm

70 WEEKS COMPLETED
Newton contended that the 70 weeks represent 490 years that ended with the death of Jesus Christ (from NEWTON'S PROPHICIES OF DANIEL)

Is that you sweetie? I have missed you around here.

I am praying that you stick around with us.



Love ya,

Val

Messiahiscoming

LOL

Some of us may be greatly persecuted and not have access to water brother.

But if so I will have Mikveh'd.... washed in the living waters.

And we will be caught up into the Air with The dead rising first and we will all be dressed in white.

hey but if the persecusion is too heavy... maybe I'll be of the dead... Hopefully burried in White...

My rough guestimation would be 2043 or there abouts. It will be more clear as the day draws near.

Blessings
bananna

I missed you, too.

Thank you for making my day. That means alot to me.

Signet

So nice to have you back Signet......I hope you are rested.....you are needed
love C

Thank you for the welcome home!

Signet

I wonder if the "New Moon" mightn't be Cruithne, (Pron. 'croo-een-ya') the so-called 'other moon' of our planet.

Apparently, it runs in a strange, horseshoe pattern, 'around' our earth, sometimes following along with us in our orbital before pivoting. Here's a link for the website I found this on. Its quite strange to me, but I thought it might make for an interesting look into those odd astronomical phenomena that prophets, seers, and Mayans seem to like. Surely it must, at times, become visible in the night sky. It would be interesting to find out if there is a probability of seeing it appear over Jerusalem, based on some sort of calulation.

It was particularly interesting to note that this object is cited for drawing astroids into our midst with its gravitational field.

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/blobra...se/cruithne.htm

------------

Just as a matter of incidence, this is my first post, and I'll introduce myself here.

My name is Jason. I am absolutely fascinated with Bible Codes, Astronomy, Science, Theology, and just about anything else in Creation. While I'm not by any means devout, I was raised Catholic. I'm one of those 'lost' agnostics, I think, for lack of a better term, inasmuch as I find that science seems to strengthen my belief in the idea of a Creator Entity, but I just don't know what to say of the whole idea.

Anyway, I'm all apologies if my posting style was somewhat unorthodox. I thought this morsel might be of interest to those who find stargazing and prophecy of interest.

Cheers and Thanks for the Site! Its great!

Hey Jason,

Welcome to the forum. I found your post extremely interesting. I had never heard of that asteroid. I think that you'll find interesting reading at AnswersinGenesis.org Give it a look. See you on the trail, David

Rosh Hashannah is actually a BAbylonian festival. it is the beginning of the BAbylonian year. the jews did tie that into the feast of trumpets but according to the calendar you are using for this post, every month, you have no idea when it will begin becasue each month would require the siteing of the new moon....

The reason also as to why hte messianics and christians in the evangelical camp say the feast of trumpets is that they believe that t only the feasts that occur in teh first half of the year were fulfilled and the fall feasts will be fulfille d in the future, since the feast of trumpets is the next one, then it must be it.

The problem with this view is that the feast itself must have some REAL tie in to the actual occurance.. in other words, the feast itself has to represent, in type or allogically, what occurs in it's fulfillment by Christ....

Well, what was the feat of trumpets biblically? A trumpet would sound, right? For how many days?

you got it.. 7 days....

There was also what was understood by the jews as the ten days of awe... The feast of trumpets was a WARNING, "sound the alarm".

But for whom?

For the jews!

Why? Because it meant impending judgement wsa to come.

And who would receive this judgement?

This judgement was received by those who had not had their sins covered by the blood of the lamb. But when would this judgement occur? at he beginning of this feast?

NO and yet pretribbers use this feast as the day of some future rapture and 7 years of trbulation to occur to follow the 7 trumpet blasts and during this time, judgement.!

That breaks the typology and pattern of this feast on so many levels, it is obvious, the ministers who teacht aht stuff have NO understanding of the bible patterns.

the jews , in the OLD TESTAMENT, would go during this time, during these ten days, to the grace sites of their deceased... What would they do?

They would pray for their deceased, that God would have mercy on them, NOT UNLIKE Judas MAcabees did during the time of Aniochus Ephihanes... (yet, many protestants will teach God raised a man up to restore the temple but somehow, this man was a heretic at the same timeby his actions, they accept hanuchah, Chrsit patterned himself during the feast of hanuchah after Judahs MAcabees but MAcabees was a heretic according to some) Besides praying for their deseased, they would ALSO ASK FOR PRAYER , interceeding for them! This was part of JUDAISM! (yet, some will say the Roman CAtholic church came up with praying to saints as if we came up with it in thin air, we have Macabees as a good example of one who did what we also do today).

The jews would also, during this time, go and make reparation for sin by goign to those they opffended AND go to the temple and offer sacrifice so their sins would be covered....

Why? Because the day of atonemnt, Yom Kipuur was coming....

And waht was Yom Kippur? the day of atonement......

On that day, the high priest would enter the temple, and have it cleansed. Cleansed of what" BLOOD. it wsa , in one manner of speaking, spring cleaning. The temple had become defiled and requiring cleansing after a full year of blood sacrifice.

I am not going to go intot he full ritual but to say that a few doves were used, (we see the vestiture of Christs garment dipped in blood when he comes at armegeddon, don't we, he is fulfilling a type pattern of the dove here), but there was the taking of the sins that had been transfered tot he altar by the blood, now transfered to the goat for azazel. This goat would be led into the wilderness to die for the sins accumulated. When Christ died for our sins, fulfilling passover, the lamb's blood TRANSFERED the sin from your head to it's head and it's blood was taken and placed on the horns of the altar. Thsi is waht is termed covered for sin. It was only a covering. This is what Chrsit's blood did.. transfer from yoru head to his, your sin. On the day of atonement, the high priests takes that same sin that wsa covered by the blood and transfered this sin to the head of the goat for azazel and this goat would die i the silerness.

When the high priest would emerge from the temple and proclaimed that all the sins had been forgiven and transfered, whose soins was he speaking of? ONLY THOSE SINS THAT HAD ALREADY been offered up in sacrifice at the temple the year before. The ten days of awe, the trumpet blasts, teh sounding the alarm wsa to awaken the jews to the fact the the judgement for sin wsa coming . If their sin was not trasnfered tot he temple altar by the time the day of atonement came, then once the goat for azel wsa sent out with those sins, it was TOO LATE to offer sacrifice, yoru sin would not have to be paid for by you and you alone!

So, Chrsit sits, offering his blood today, today is the day of atonement. The day yoru sins are no longer received for forgiveness is the day satan is thrown in the bottomless pit becasue it is that day, he receives his just reward for the corruption he was responsilbe for. Those people who have not repented would then be judged for the sins they still carried, instead of having them covered, then trasfered to satan in teh end.

THOSE ARE THE TYPES and PATTERNS.

So, Chrsit does not leave the heavenly temple til when? Til evangelization has fulfiled it's purpose... Til that time, people continue to be saved, continue to repent. When people stop repenting, the last sheep has come in, then the doors are locked. We see this during one of the bowl judgements, they repented NOT but blasphemied God.... And their kingdom became very dark, the withdrawl of the holy spirit has occured)

No early rapture, release, the day of wrath and judgement occurs whent he day of atonemnt is over.

God Bless

Hey, thanks for the reading.

You know, some strange things occurred to me today, while reading up on the internet. First and foremost is the fact that the Bible codes just absolutely blow my mind...and, to be truthful, scare the living bejeebers out of me.

I had a look at the AiG site that was suggested, and, let me tell you, my brain is in knots, right now. The whole idea of trying to understand G-d in the multitude of ways He is presented to us quite frankly blows my mind. There are a lot of strange things in science which I think the people who are 100% devoutly opposed to the idea of the existence of a God ought to consider.

1) The M-Theories, String Theories, and newly emerging fields of quantum mechanics seem to suggest that there truly is absolutely no limit on what can or can not be. Essentially, if we can dream it up, we've automatically given it a home in the universe...Lots of details to mull over in that concept, but, I think its more polite if I leave them for people with an interest.

2) FOr people who absolutely refuse to believe in the idea of a heaven or a hell...The idea of a Black Hole scares me more than anything out there. Some scientists have suggested that time is so warped in the center of them as to be slowed to next to nothing, if not actually frozen near or inside of the Singularity. The idea of being sucked into one of those while alive seems a pretty horrifying prospect, especially if there's anything to the idea of a second being stretched out over the course of billions of years whilst one is being ripped apart in any number of directions...I guess I can't really speak about what's in there, as I've never been, but...Yikes. Some people have suggested that Hell is no more or less than a mistranslation of Oblivion from Greek to English...etc etc (as I'm sure many of you know), but...What about the journey there?

3) If Quantum theory holds to the notion that a universe of planets which are all giant apples, orbiting singing ducks can exist alongside of our own perceivable universe...I mean...if something THAT ridiculous 'can' actually *be*, then...it seems fair to say that a universe of liquid fire need not be too far flung an idea.

I think one of the things that amazes me most about the often all too present division between science and religion is that science, in many ways, seems to uphold the idea that any of these 'far flung' ideas from the Bible are impossible, while at the same time, supporting a theory (which is admittedly not verbatim, though the creative license I am unable to quote word for word was quite similar) as far flung as apples and ducks.

I'll say this: I'll probably never really know what's what until I'm there...but these new bible codes...especially the Mene-Tekel codes are really starting to throw things into a new persective for me...
WIth all of the above in mind...When one takes the universe Ad Infinitum...that is to say...when quite literally anything suggestible is plausible, I must really wrestle with the idea of trying to figure out which faith is the "Right" one, because...let me tell you...all of this "I'm on the way" stuff people seem to be unearthing in their bible codes has really got me cringing in my seat.

Cheers
Jason

And now, Comet McNaught is in the sky...

Truly, truly ominous.

A great post indeed.
Yeshua HaMaschiach's return is certainly imminent. His Name, Yeshua is of course the Name that we pray in and through to the Father of Lights. As we pray through the Name Yeshua we can be assured that He hears our cry to Him and will answer. The 'yesh' in Yeshua, signifies that He is the I AM and the I HAVE as well. eg. 'yesh-li = I have " or 'yesh - lecha? = do you have?". Yeshua is also the Great YESH, the Great Provider who said that 'all power is given to me in earth and in heaven'. He HAS us in the palm of his hand because we are the apple of His Eye. 'SHUA' is of course 'salvation' .... He IS and HAS Salvation for all who will come to Him and He will in no wise cast them out when they come in truth seeking Him alone.

He is coming to us with His 'yesh' and His 'Shua' .... with Himself..... having Salvation...Yeshua HaMaschiach

Jason....

Do you know Quantum Physics? If you do...start a thread about it somewhere and lets talk about it because I love that stuff. What I read about it all is so fascinating. But my understanding is very basic. Not my field of study although I love to read about it.

College

The scripture says that heaven and earth will pass away But of that day and hour no one knows. The day and the hour? How about the month or the year? Which day was being referred to a 24 hour day or a 1000 year day? How about those who have been given a part in Christ for the end time? Was the scripture even talking about knowing the time of the return of Christ or were the pointers set on the Passing away of heaven and earth which is after the Thousand year kingdom?

Stated a different way ..... when will the Lord intervene. He has not gone anywhere. He is omnipresent and is watching .... we just cannot see Him. No one has or does know when He will begin His active end time involvement. He has made this quite clear and has also made it impossible for anyone to know. He does not want this date to be known and there will not be any warnings, signs, or events preceeding the time. If there were, one would know by observing them. All of the signs and events recorded for the time of the end in scripture will begin just after and within the time frame of period ..... not before. There is no contradiction in the Lord's Word. The time [date] that one cannot know is the beginning of the period ..... the one you could know if you experience the tribulation period would be the ending date. You could do this by observing the bench mark events recorded in scripture scheduled for the period. The beginning and ending dates are obviously not the same.

Did you ever notice how it is present tense? No one knowETH or knowS. That means now, not never! Thank the Lord! He never said that nobody would EVER know, did he? Did he EVER say that no one would EVER know? Of course not. Is Jesus also never going to know? Again, I don't think anyone would venture to say that Jesus and us both would have no warning as to his return. Also, is he coming like a thief? Sure, he said he is, but for who? Well, not those that are in the know right. Those that watch. Anyways, this list is not in any way complete, just a few references. God bless. Marc

2 References for KNOWETH:-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mark 13:32--------
But of that day or that hour KNOWETH (present tense) no one, not even the angels in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.

Matthew 24:36-------
But of that day and hour KNOWETH no one, not even the angels of heaven, neither the Son, but the Father only.

(Also, he is returning after the tribluation period and on the day of the Lord, which is actually a year!)
DOTL=1 Year

5 References for Day=Year:-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Isaiah 34:8------------
For Jehovah hath a day of vengeance, a year of recompense for the cause of Zion.

Isaiah 61:2------------
to proclaim the year of the Lord's favor, and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn;

Isaiah 63:4-----------
For the day of vengeance was in my heart, and the year of my redeemed is come.

Jeremiah 23:12-----------
Wherefore their way shall be unto them as slippery places in the darkness: they shall be driven on, and fall therein; for I will bring evil upon them, even the year of their punishment, saith Jehovah.

Jeremiah 48:44------------
He that fleeth from the fear shall fall into the pit; and he that getteth up out of the pit shall be taken in the snare: for I will bring upon him, even upon Moab, the year of their punishment, saith Jehovah.

Luke 4:17-19-------------
17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Isaiah. And he opened the book, and found the place where it was written,
18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, Because he anointed me to preach good tidings to the poor: He hath sent me to proclaim release to the captives, And recovering of sight to the blind, To set at liberty them that are bruised,
19 To proclaim the year of the Lord's favor.

5 References for coming as a thief:-------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 Thessalonians 5:2----------
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

1 Thessalonians 5:4----------
But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief:

2 Peter 3:10------------
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall be dissolved with fervent heat, and the earth and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Revelation 3:3-------------
Remember therefore how thou hast received and didst hear; and keep it, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

Revelation 16:15-------------
(Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.)

This is true and brilliant.

But the rest of it is nonsense.

If no one will ever know then it can't happen.

When the Lords witnesses start their ministry and shut up heaven so that no rain falls on the earth.
When the Lords two witnesses turn the waters of earth to blood.
When they start their ministry 1335 days before the return of the Lord.
This leaves very visible markers and signs written in scripture narrowing down the time to the month.
Don't the Lords witnesses know who they are and what they must do? Aren't they somebody?

The coming of the Lord's two prophets is a very visible sign. Starting in July Guaranteed.

Amen, this is Scripture
C

Please go into more detail......"Starting in July Guaranteed"


.........Whirlwind

It SOUNDs to me like somebody has been getting into a little bit too much numerology. I don't see how else you could come to that kind of conclusion. Guys, this is a spirit that deceives people, it happens a lot, it's a very common spirit. He likes to get people caught up in the numbers thing, flipping verse numbers and adding them and subtracting etc. It's all very silly, look at this ridiculous site from a guy who WAS associated with my ministry.

http://www.californiajudgment2008.citymax....age/4415325.htm and http://www.sandiegowarning2008.com/index.html

This is what happens to people that decide to start taking their predictions too seriously. They LIE and go on other peoples radio shows and start saying, "Thus saith the Lord July 8, 2008 San Diego will be nuked". Rubbish. This is what we call a deceiving spirit guys. You wanna guarantee something, guarantee that you don't know for sure. Either that or come up with some SOLID biblical evidence of your claim, and even then, fear and trembling guys, fear and trembling. We don't have any need of rushing to any conclusions, it's not going to kill you NOT to know for sure.

This is what we DO know though. As a type of the end times that Jesus gave is the story of Noah. God told Noah 7 days before when the flood would come. The flood is apparently the Day of the Lord and the 7 days is apparently the 7 years. From the beginning of the tribulation, we can then know when the rapture and resurrection will happen among many other events. But, until then, we're kinda stuck aren't we? Still, we don't need to know. That's what Jesus told his disciples, that they had no need of knowing the times and dates. And frankly, neither do we. Not until the tribulation.

Hope this helps, God bless,
Marc

By the way, if I had to guess, I'd say the tribulation will start next year, but that could be wrong. One way to find out for sure isn't there, wait and see.

Also, as far as the two witnesses and all of the rest of the book of Revelation go, be careful not to see things literally or physically. Remember,

2 Corinthians 3:6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of a new covenant; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

Here is an excellent short article/teaching on "The Spirit of Prophecy"

http://www.americaslastdays.com/?page=prophecy

Here it is unformatted, it's better if you follow the link.

---The Spirit of Prophecy---

--Types and Shadows--

"For they that dwell in Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath, fulfilled them by condemning him" (Acts 13:27).

How is it that they studied the prophets writings about the Messiah and quoted them but they did not know the prophets voices or know Jesus? They obviously expected the Messiah to set up a physical kingdom to rule over their physical enemies (Jn 6:14,15 / Acts 1:6) but Jesus said "My kingdom is not of this world" (Jn 18:36). How could they see physical in prophecies where spiritual was meant? The key is in Jesus' statement "seeing (physical) they see not (spiritual) and hearing (physical) they hear not (spiritual), neither do they understand" (Mt 13:13,14).

While God's people were looking for a Messiah that did not exist, the one prophesied stood in their midst. Could God's people today make the same kind of mistake when they read in Revelation about the Beast, the Harlot, the false Prophet, the manchild, the woman, the mark and Image of the Beast, etc? "That which hath been done is that which shall be done" (Ecl 1:9). They will not recognize these entities when they are standing in their midst because of physical interpretations of a spiritual word. Let me give you another example. Jesus said "Except ye eat the flesh of the son of man and drink his blood, ye have not life on yourselves" (Jn 6:63). Jesus spoke of his word and his life but they had only fleshly eyes to see. Many disciples said "this is a hard saying, who can hear it (verse 60) and they left him (66). Jesus' explanation was "It is the spirit (the unseen) that giveth life, the flesh (the seen) profiteth nothing: the words that I have spoken unto you are spirit, and are life (verse 63).

As the flesh is only a vehicle for the unseen spirit, so Jesus' words carried an unseen spiritual meaning for those who had spiritual eyes to see. Paul taught us that the letter (flesh) of the old covenant, which brought death had to be translated into the spirit of the new covenant which brought life (2 Cor 3:6,7). Living under the letter in any form kills but the spirit gives life and freedom. Some examples of this are proven by Jesus and the Apostles teachings about the ceremonial law (not the moral law). For example, animal sacrifice is fulfilled by the sacrifice of Christ. Circumcision is fulfilled by baptism, the cutting off of all flesh (Col 2:11,12). The Sabbath is fulfilled by a life-style of ceasing from our works, and entering into God's by faith in his promises (Heb 4:1-3, 9-11). The 10 percent stewardship of the tithe is fulfilled by the 100 percent stewardship of renouncing all ownership (Lk 14:33). Now you may disagree with one or more of my examples but we still have to stay in the "unity of the spirit" (Epe 4:3) "till we all attain unto the unity of the faith" (verse 13). The point is letter must be interpreted to spirit as is the example given us in the New Testament.

God spoke in parables and symbols in the Old Testament and in the New Testament, when indicated, in order to hide the truth from the merely religious, so he could reveal it only to disciples (learners and followers) (Mk 4:11,12,33,34). God hides the truth so that only the righteous can seek it out (Pr 25:2). This way the proud religious fakes can be "ever learning (the letter) and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth" (2 Tim 3:7). "I thank thee, oh Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou didst hide these things from the wise and understanding (scribes, Pharisees, religious leaders and prophecy preachers of our day and those who trust them), and didst reveal them unto babes...(Lk 10:21). 1 Cor 10:11 says "Now these things happened unto them (Jews) by way of example (Greek: Figure or Type) and they were written for our admonition, upon whom the end of the ages are come. Revelation (Greek: uncover, unveil) and Daniel are obviously example of God hiding the truth from "the many" (2 Cor 2:17). Revelation was a sign that Jesus gave to John (Rev 1:1). The Spirit of Revelation is "hidden manna' that only overcomers can partake of (Rev 2:17). John called this Revelation the "testimony of Jesus" (1:2,9 / 22:20).

In Rev 19:10 he said "the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy". The letter of Revelation, which is seen of the natural, carnal man has hidden within its body the spirit of prophecy, which is the true revelation of the end time. Those who "hold the testimony of Jesus" overcome the Devil and "keep the commandments of God" (Rev 12:17,11). Jesus and his disciples held the spirit of prophecy (testimony of Jesus) and they were killed by those who held the letter. The letter kills but the spirit gives life! Nothing has changed. In the tribulation sincerely religious people, who hold the letter, will put to death those who hold the spirit (the testimony of Jesus - Rev 20:4). Those who hold the spirit of prophecy will not worship the beast or his image or take his mark because they recognize these. Those who see only the letter will fall away and take the mark because they do not see in the spirit. In Daniel's time all Israel but the three Hebrews bowed to the Image of the beast (Dan 3:7-12). In Elijah's time ten of the twelve tribes bowed to the Image of the beast (the golden calf). These are types of the end time falling away (1 Cor 10:11). The falling away in 2 Thes 2:3 just before the coming of the Lord (verse 1) will be because "God sendeth" those who don't love truth, "a working of error, that they should believe a lie" (verses 10,11). What could be more "God sent" than the word and what could be more "a working of error" than the letter that kills (2 Cor 3:6).

Because they accept man's interpretation (letter) they will not overcome and will be spewed out of the body of Christ and blotted out of the book of life (Rev 3:16,5). It is urgent brethren that we seek the truth now! History is my witness, the overwhelming majority of God's people have been wrong on any given matter. What has been popular has never been the truth. In most cases this is because of respect for men and because the letter can be made less threatening to the flesh, and costs nothing to obtain. What religion were you before you became what you are now? Did you think you were right then, before you discovered you were wrong? Could you be wrong now? Then you must "seek out your own salvation with fear and trembling." "Cursed is the man that trusts in man" (Jer 17:5). Don't trust in yourself, or your religious leaders, or me. Trust in your Savior and the Word of God. Since "the sum of thy words is truth", do you know enough of the word to make up your mind? If you haven't diligently studied the word and you have made up your mind then you trust in man and you will be cursed. I offer you in the chapters ahead understanding that I received from God, but then everyone says that. You won't know if this is true unless you pray and study the word. Before long you will have to come to an opinion on these things and I pray for you to have eyes to see.

God bless ya'll,
Marc

Hey Shekel what you mention:

{1} Just as the timing and nature of the first coming of Christ was misunderstood by the people of that day (John 7), so it shall be again before His Second Coming, to the likely bewilderment of that future end-time people. For this cause, enlightenment is given at this time––so as to supply that future end-time-tribulation-people with a thorough understanding of the many complex time-frames possible, destined to emerge at that time, so that they may have faith and hope to endure it. For by recognizing the various time-periods and patterns in history, this future end-time people will be better equipped to correctly (but never perfectly) apply that knowledge to their own unfolding trial.


Agreed you can see this pattern in the feast of Passover (the Lord's supper), no one understood the prophetic meaning of Passover or it's fullfilment, until Jesus came and said "I'm the wine, the bread, the lamb, etc......"

"By His knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many".

No one knows the the true prophetic meaning of the Fall feasts, not only that but no one knows how Jesus fulfills the other spring feasts at His resurection.... (Passover, first fruits and Unleavened bread lasts 8 days).

Likewise when Jesus returns He will explain the remainder of the spring feasts and how He fulfils the fall feasts and why He
He must fulfill them before being revealed to the world....

Jesus was on earth 30 years before He began His first work, as Melchizadek (priest) chances are Jesus will again begin His second work (fall feasts) at 30....But be revealed at the 2nd marriage supper of the lamb on earth...

Passover was the first marriage supper of Jesus with His apostles, (blood of the covenant)....

Tabernacles is the other feast that lasts 8 days, "full moon" = fulness of time as the bible uses a moon based calendar.
Passover and the first day of tabernacles are the only feasts that are kept on a "full moon".

And because Tabernacles/Ingathering is for all nations then truly when Jesus keeps this feast then the times of the gentiles are fulfilled! And He and the saints will resurrect on earth (from above) to join Him, especially the 120 disciples...

Jesus can only eat and drink as a physical human...So look for Jesus at this feast, in the fulness of time.

I often wonder if the end of times will come in one foul swoop, and we wont even know what hit us.
Or if its gradual, and we can see it comming slowly, and building up.

Shekel;

I don't deal very much with Daniels 70th week because there are too many ways to go with it.

I wonder how many people have read the "writting on the wall". I have believed Saddam is the antichrist for about 6-7 years now. He is a very likely candidate. He's "an Assyrian", which is what many of the old timer bible prophecy experts believed.

There are too many fingers pointing to Saddam for this to be "coincidence".
Muslim's believe that the "Mahdi" (12th Imam) will return to unite the Sunni and Shia sects of Islam.
"By peace he shall destroy many". Bin Laden also believes he is one of the prophecied ones.
I tend to think Bin Laden, Hussein, Assad, and Ahmadinejad are the riders of the four horsemen of the Apocalypse. They will usher in the tribulation and the events leading up to the open scroll.

Bin Laden is the rider of the white horse which is symbolic of "holy war".
Hussein could be the rider of the red horse. Assad and Ahmadinejad could be the riders of the other two. The four horsemen are the opening characters and the prelude to, and major contributers to the beginning of the tribulation. The only one I'm sure of thus far is that Revelation 6:2 is symbolic of holy war and bin Laden is the rider. In fact on some television specials about bin Laden, I have heard it said that "He is the worldwide symbol of holy war"!
I also believe that the next round of terror attacks will be the opening of the third seal.
Famine is on the way. I would certainly watch out on October 28th. The Muslim's like to do major terror attacks in honor of Muslim dictator's. Most must know by now that Assad's birthday is on Sept 11. Damascus harbors a headquaters for nearly every Muslim terror organization in the Middle East. Which is why it will soon become a ruinous heap!

God bless,

SW

hey guys + gals,



here is something that I feel is important,

I want to eventually send it to all the web churches I can,

to see how I could be in error,,,

or is this really the Truth,

there is a deadline for the return of Christ,

that is,,,

a date that Christ must come back before,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,



this is the start of a letter to send out the alarm call,

I would like it if you could assist me in this project,

could I please get you to help me edit this,,,

pleasssssssssseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee



This is what I have come to call,

"2020 VISION"

The reason for this date setting title,

Although I hesitate to say these words,

as there is such a stigmatism with date setting,

But,,, I see this as important,

and feel an urgent necessity,

for this news to get out,

I feel an urgency for us Christians to know this fact,,,



I believe God’s timing is getting very near,

and have discovered hard facts,,,

about there being a certainty,

Why Christ simply MUST return,,, before the year 2020.

And it also has duel meaning,,,

20/20 is perfect vision,,,

(with my +5 bottle bottom glasses, this is sure not from me,,, lol)



My Christian Brother/Sister,

Sorry for the length of this letter,

but I feel that these words are all,

of the utmost importance for you to hear,



First, I will share with you a quick list of my beliefs,

and then move straight to what I think needs to come out,,, NOW !!!

I will attempt to do this, with logic, and the details about His Word,

that I believe God wants the deadline to come out into the light,

Then I will show you a list of all the mathematics and Bible verses,

that brought me to these startling conclusions,,,

one that I have trouble seeing why no one has seen before.



Lastly, I will tell you a little bit more about myself,

to give you a better idea of just who this warrior is.

To make things quicker to refer to, easier for reading,

and to let you easily get to the most important parts,

I have colored the most important stuff in red,,,,,,,,,

For easier referencing and quicker reading,

Please,,,,, read this through, and do not just rashly cast it aside,.

Passing me off as just another fanatic,

ranting about something I know nothing about.

I may be a fanatic,,,,,, but I have become a fanatic about God,

so I try to use this energizing emotional charge and feeling,

in the most productive way for the Kingdom.



I try to read His Word daily, usually studying it intensely,

believing only, in the prophecies that can be found in the Bible.

I want to share with you, a few things that I believe,

and then some things that I believe the Almighty GOD has shared with me,

But I want you to first know a few rather important things about me,

things which may help you, be able to better know my heart + mind,

I also hope that you will pray to the Father,

and ask Him to show you gow I speak the Truth,

As well as, so He can point out to you, where I may be in error,

Because this is a very serious subject,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

and I need and want to have someone proofing my writing,

so I do not lead my fellow Christian brothers and sisters astray,



My beliefs are:

. There is a real God = He does exist, and He is the God of the bible,

. He is a personal God, and lives within me = in the form of the Holy Spirit,

. Jesus is God, = Emmanuel, God with us, (Mathew 1:23)

. I believe in the Trinity = I believe that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all One God,

. I believe in the pre-trib rapture, that will happen before the 7 Hebrew years of tribulation

. The Holy Bible is truly the inerrant Word of God, there are not mistakes, I trust in it

. The earth is only about 6000 years old, the layers in the earth were layered in the flood,

. The Bible Code is Truth, and who knows how much of His-story is recorded there,

. We are now living in the "End Times", or the time just before Christ’s imminent return,

. Aliens are real = they are not more evolved than us though, they are fallen angels:



There is something that I have been feeling troubled about,,,,,,,,,,

I call this my 20/20 Vision, as

it involves Christ's retorn before the year 2020.

This thought came to me about a month ago,

while I was thinking about the verse about how we would know when His coming was near,

and the part about how

I believe that we are the generation that will not have to experience death.

I was convinced, that God would give us fair warning, of just how close His coming was.

Most evryone knows about the verse Mathew 24:36, "But of that day and hour knoweth no man,,,", when speaking the date of Christ's return. But the verse that I want to discuss, is Mathew 24:33, where it says

"So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.".

This door might represent "a deadline",

or must "happen by" date,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

I want to learn Greek, to see how all of His Word was first written,,,

but especially I wish to view and understand this verse, about us being able to know that the time is near.

I think that He is telling us that we can KNOW how close it is, by giving us the deadline,,, or showing us the door,,, but we still don't know when His Knock will come, (rapture).

And this deadline,(door) can be found,,,

and I think that He wants this knowledge to come out.

We can find this deadline because it says,

"we shall know the generation,,,"

By starting from the date of Israel regaining control of Jerusalem, = (as it is part of "see all these things"),

which was the summer of 1967.

Then, calculating the duration of a generation by taking Christ's linage of 14,14+14 generations-

(Mathew 1:17).

This gives us a "generatiom" eaqual to 51.6 years.

I used this duration of time as it was the same duration used to accurately predicted the date,

May 14, 1948,

as the rebirth of Isreal = ( taken from the book "Armigeddon" by Grant Jeffery )

So,,, now we take 1967.5-6, and then add the 51.6 years for the generation,

where it is said "this generation shall not pass".

That gives an end date of 2019.1 to 2019.2,,, but certainly this mustl happen before the year 2020,,,

hince the name "20/20 Vision",,, like perfect vision,,,

not that I could ever claim that I had perfect vision, with the size of my glasses lenses,,, lol.

Since we know that all Bible prophecy speaks the Truth, as the Bible is the Word of God,

It mdate anyway, lol,,, We can know this, because we know that all Bible ust come prophecy must be TRUTH, and no prophecy can miss.

. Your Bro,

. . joe



PS: I will also incude what I have in an earlier letter, that gives you a little of my history

(could I get any input you have, good or bad, as I always appreciate any help that I can get)



(especially since what I want most,,, is to be informitive, while explaining the logic to my thinking,, on the asurity we can have in His Word)



SOME OF MY CALCULATIONS

--------------------------------------------------

14 + 14 + 14 = 42 generations

2,167 = Birth of Abraham.

(- 536.4) ???

/42 =

51.595 = genation,,,

not the 51.4, which I thought it was,



--------------------- HERE IS A LITTLE OF MY LIFE STORY ------------------------

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

I happen to be a 44 year old Canadian man,

Who also happens to be paralyzed,,,

I have always been, or at least try to be, a very loving person,

wanting to, and greatly enjoying, helping others whenever possible,

I tend to be a very energetic, a real go getter, the kind that makes things happen,

(I have built many camps in the woods, tunnels and forts in snow + hay),

(I was always greatly involved in the childhood gangs + groups),

(in highshool, I had parties at my mom’s home every few weeks,)

(I built a 16 foot x 32 foot, by 2 story add on to my mom‘s house,)

= in my second year of grade 12 English

((I only had to go to English,,, so I worked at carpentry the rest of my day))

(I was a social director at Jones House, UNB - Fredericton )



I don’t think that I ever believed in this evolution hoax,

or as I like to think of it,, EVIL-solUTION,,, lol

I think that I have always believed in God, but I just was not sure Who He was,

I have always done quite well in my school studies,

As I enjoy learning new things, especially math and science,

This is because, I like things that I can figure out and prove for myself,

You see, He gave me this very inquisitive mind,

One in which I tend to let get the better of me usually, lol,

but I would never complain about this,

or any of the gifts that God has equipped me with,

I became born again in the late 80’s

It was the book "Armageddon", by a fellow Canadian, Grant Jeffrey,

He made a pretty convincing arguement,

that proved God to me,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

I was amazed,,,

To see that so many prophecies came true,

and they even figured out right to the very day,,,,,,,

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, WOW ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

This blew me away,,, and I could hardly believe it,

My soft heart was at odds with my mathematical, logical mind,

So my critical mind, kept coming up with reasons, why I did not have to believe,

like, the reasons that the prophecies were so perfectly fulfilled,

was that, the Bible must have been written, or modified,

after the prophecies were fulfilled,



,,, but then Grant showed me one that happened in our day,

that using a previously discovered rule of God,

the prophecy of Jesus entering the temple on the correct date,

(Luke 19:44) "because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation"

could be applied to God‘s previously known rule,

(Levitivus 26:18), "And if ye will not yet for all this hearken unto me,"

then I will punish you seven times more for your sins."

of God only giving a second chance, after 7 times the original duration,

to give the date of Israel’s second chance,

or more specifically,,, May 15<sup>th, 1948,,,

That’s right,,, the very date Israel became a nation !!!



I know that I have always been gutsy,(or stupid, lol),

and a real bold one sometimes,

but this was God, was I out of line or what,,,

I asked Him to give me a sign,,,,,,,,,,,,

That what I was reading in the Bible,

was the really the True Word of God,

The most amazing thing was,,,

God answered my request,

within the same day even,



You see I was working on a project,

that I had been working on for years,

This project, was a video game idea,

that was very original at the time,

as it was to design the whole game,

with 3 dimensional rendering,

Unheard of at the time,, the early 80’s

mostly because of the computers of the day,

As in, they were not fast enough,

Nor were they powerful enough yet,

to do all that I asked of them,



But there was also another problem,

that I had to deal with,,,

the standard 2 directional joystick,

was all that I had to work with,

to somehow get all of the intricate controls,

of your on-screen arms and hands,

that I wanted the player to have,



So, He gave me this amazing picture,

that I spent the next couple of days,

getting it straight enough to put on paper,

this new joystick, which had far more controls,

than the usual joystick,

with like, 7 to 11 times the number,

of controllable activating motions,



I WAS CONVINCED !!!

THERE WAS INDEED A GOD,

AND THE BIBLE WAS HIS WORD,



I guess that I now know, why they say "careful what you wish for",

As right after I became born again,

I made, what I thought was a good prayer.,,,,,,,,,,,,

a wish that was aimed towards God,

with getting the time for learning more about His Word,

I asked God to allow me to be able to spend more time studying His Word,,,,,,,

This seemed like an innocent enough request,

And I had thought of many great ways to make this happen,

One of which was, to allow me to finish creating my video game,

Or gettting a patent for one of my joe-stick,

or use one of the other unique ideas that He let me conceive,



But instead of following any of my great suggestions, (or I thought so,,, lol)

And letting one of my unique ideas earn me a sufficient amount of money,

to pay for my room and board, and the things that I most need,

so that I could devote most all of my time, studying His Word,

that way, I could best use this mind which our Father has given me,

to look for the many mysteries that are hiding inside His Word,

which I believe are soon ready to be revealed, in these Last Days,



God All Mighty had a more humbling way of doing this,

by letting me become disabled,

so that I could no longer do physical labor,

and was put on a disability pension,

giving me my days and nights,

to spend on reading His Word,

and getting the time to dig deep,

discovering some things that have been lost,

as well as things that may have never been understood,



I was very disappointed,

To not have a mother that was well enough to take care of me at home,

and my wife and I had split up, about 6 months earlier,

Nor did I have any other friend or family member, that could help me out,

I had gotten myself into a mess, that no one else was able to help me with,

So, I had only one option,,,

I had to go live in a nursing home,,,,,,,, grrrrrrrrrrrrr



which truthfully made logical since at the time,

as I was in quite a mess,,,,,,

having died twice, then declared brain dead, and cutting off my life support,

and then not being able to speak in sentences,

This was mostly because of my severe closed head injury,

which left me so I could only say the odd word here and there,

so at least at first, I needed some serious help.



But soon, I discovered that my home was more like a prison than I knew of,

as it was about two or three years later,

after I had acquired most of the life skills for living on my own back,

that I found out that I was not allowed to live out on my own,

( this was while I was attending courses at the local NSCC = (college))



You see, although I tend to buck against most all rules,

especially if I feel that someone is being wronged,

but I tend not to like to cause waves,

and usually tried to not push things,

while trying to keep people happy,

especially with the people that I had to live with,



It took them making me extremely angry,

by doing me a seriously blaitant wrong,

that forced me to feel that I had to look into it deeper,

you see, I was steamed, to think that,

I had to let them get away with it,

as they wronged me in a very sly way,



by canceling the bus that I had booked,

to take me back within the 30 day grace period,,,,,,,,

It was not until after many years,,,,,,,,

that I learned the reasoning for their decission,

They considered me "incompetent", !!!!!!!!!!!!

because of my lack of short term memory I suspect,



So,,, I looked the word up on the www,

to finding out that it meant,

A mentally chalenged person, that could not even,

score over an 85 on an IQ test,



Even without ever taking one, I was sure that I could pass this score,

so I took a few free tests, on-line,

and I was not only capable of passing,,,

I scored past the maximum score it was rated accurate for,



well, I manage to pass it with no problem,

and I have since moved, out into an apartment,

where I was getting myself out into the real world,

and soon, I got an even better place to live,

I moved into a house, with my lovely wife,

and she is a fantastic life partner,

to fight life’s struggles along side of,

Yes, I speak of an awesome coworker and friend,

because she’s a fellow believer in Christ,,,



I have been able to get the time to,

discover many enlightening things about His Word,

with this mind that I have received from my Lord,

some of things included are,,,

(1) - I try not to use the words "I am",

as I have come to believe that this is the Name of God.

because in Exodus 3:14 God says:

"Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you."



(2) - I know that the Trinity is a problem for many people,

so I asked for some enlightenment,

and I believe that the good Lord has shown me,

a good way of explaining the Trinity doctrine,,,

stating GOD as compared to man

the Godhead is a Trinity

and man is also made in three parts

Father = mind = in power, intelligence, memory

Son = body = your frame, the part that feels, does +

(this contains the mind + soul) - verse = ?

Holy Spirit = soul = personality, temperament, emotions



(3) - Since becoming "born again", I have always known in my heart,

that we are the last generation spoken of,

in the Bible, that will get to see Christ return,

in all of His Glory and Power,

and I was always looking for the proof,

to show both believers, and non believers,

just how close His coming was,,,



Now,,,, please spread this arguement that I have shown you,,,

around to all the people that you know,

as I cannot see why no one has seen this before,

please trust me, as I can give you lots of,

Bible verses, and solid strong proof,

so that you can do your own calculation of the dates and times,

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX



Your Bro,

joe</sup>



Just one of His creations:
joe Lynch
One_Christian_Warrior@yahoo.ca

One intrance to my net of Web Pages

http://www.geocities.com/joe_born_again/ONE_CHRISTIAN_WARRIOR.htmll
One of my Blogs

http://pre-trib-force.blogspot.com/

Actually, 20/20 vision is considered the normal baseline of healthy eyesight. It is far from perfect however.
I have 20/13 in the left eye and 20/10 in the right which is far superior vision to 20/20.

You do realize that you are prophesying do you not?
If the prophecy fails, do you realize also that you have been listening to a decieving spirit?
I am not saying this to doubt you, but to raise the level of awareness that this is just a prophecy.

As far as Jesus returning before 2020, well see. I think it will be much sooner than that. It would be my desire that he come back today and rid this world of those who willfully transgress his covenant.

The thing about setting dates is that it leaves people hoping to have the prophecy confirmed. Should it fail, it usually leads the person making the prophecy and the ones who embrace it into doubt. Many men have destroyed many weak babes with this very thing.
The Devil uses truth more than he does the lie. In fact, There is not one place I have ever found where the devil actually lied! He changes the truth and transforms it into a lie.

There have been thousands of "prophecies" concerning the return of Jesus in the last 40 years. Nearly every one of them has failed. I do hope that should your prophecy fail, you have equal energy in publically repenting for it as well. Most of the time people will crawfish and make excuse saying "I didn't get it all at the time" or it is a "continually unfolding prophecy", "I mis-understood it at the time" etc. Of course, my question to those people is:
"Well, why didn't you keep your mouth shut until you got it all then?"

No, I am not going to "trust you". God does not trust his saints and even his angels he charged with folly.
I will take note of the prophecy though.

You may very well be right on the pre-20/20 return. I think you are. But reading the rest of what you had to say, I think you are hearing from alot of spirits.