I've always been curious, with all of the people in this country praying that abortion be outlawed, why hasn't God answered?

I posed the question to someone the other day and they replied, "God won't interfere with freewill."

So, I thought about that, then I thought - What if a Christian needed a job, and, they prayed about it, and, got a job, because God intervened on their part.
That would mean that a bunch of other people that applied for that job wouldn't get it, but, God's servant would. Meaning, not everyone is happy with the outcome because only one person got the job, and, a lot of others didn't. But, God provided for His own as promised.

So, why not the same thing with this issue? Or, has God answered, just not how Christians thought He would?

Any replies welcome.

I truly do not know the whole answer to your question.. but my Bible reading today brings this to mind..

but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened...

...they are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness...

...because of your [their] hard and impenitent heart you [they] are storing up wrath for yourself [themselves] on the day of wrath when God's righteous judgment will be revealed

It makes me think...Do we look at God as a one that we must please and appease like all them other pagan OT 'gods'?

'if we're good and do the right things, God will answer our prayers..'

I'm OK when I'm hearing from THE MAN, but when I am not hearing I get frustrated... I always think (and have a tendancy to apply common beliefs)

"Is there some sin in my life I need to repent of ??" and "Is God punishing me for inniquities??"

What do I do after that? Pray more, smile more, go to church more, tithe more, volunteer more... I start doing all those things that I think will catch God's attention, so I can get his approval, and we can be hiking buddies again.

Like Job I fling my arms, screaming at the storm...

Then one day, the light-bulb (the Big Bang) came on in my head...

If I can sit in the same room with a loved one and we can be comfortable in each others presence and not say a word.... Me and God can too..

But I know I can't do that with just just any loved one, but someone that I know (and knows me) intimately/emotionally over many years.

I was afraid of the silence...

Then Gods asks me to go and fix him a cup of coffee...


What does this have to do with abortion? Nothing. But I know God still hears us....

Researcher,

You are a deep thinker! God knows everything that is going to happen in this world. God is a loving, powerful and very Personal God who loves us so much!! Now some people have asked me this question: "If your God is so loving than why does he allow evil?" In my service to the Lord I have found that it could do more damage to a persons faith (or lack of) in using Scriptures to win an argument with an unbeliever. I also find it strangely unsettling and confusing when so many unbelievers claim no faith in God and yet so many still believe in the devil. Perhaps this might be because the Holy Spirit does not live in the life of the unbelievers and they are unable to see Godly moments/Godly appointments. Researcher, as a believer in the Lord, I believe everything good/bad can be used for the Glory of God.

Abortion is the result of poor leadership, coupled with indifference, multiplied by Christians that silence the voice of the Holy Spirit. While it is true that God knows everything that is going to happen it is also true that God knows the little baby in the womb. For it is written: "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations." Jeremiah 1: 5

One thing I am learning is this: every evil in life can be a learning experience for this Christian. I don't know the "whys" only God does and that is good enough for me. All I can do is to continue being a voice in the wilderness that speaks against abortion. One such lessson is that we as Christians can not take up the banner and speak up for life and yet remain silent as an abortion doctor is killed by a minister. We as Christians are never, ever to save a life by taking a life. And if we ever meet a woman that is guilt ridden and torn up by her past that contained an abortion we must speak words of Grace and comfort to her.

Sorry Researcher. A topic that hits home for me since I could never have my own children. And it used to really pain me when someone at work got pregnant and had an abortion. I would cry silently and scream, "Why couldn't that baby have been mine." But then again God is the Creator and I am not. And that pain I suffered was part of a Godly appointment that I had to meet. And I have learned to say, "Thank-you God for my infertality."

Have a good day. Keep praying for all our unborn babies that deserve the chance to be born.

Gods Blessings,

Al

Thanks for the responses Al, Appy, and HIF.

Al, you mentioned the verse about God knowing Jeremiah before he was born (Jeremiah 1: 5), so, since Jeremiah was a special case, a person to be used by God to speak to nations, what about all the people that won't be saved? Of course, God knows everything, so, undoubtedly He would know everyone before they were born I suppose, but, there seems to be special note of those called to be used by Him. Would God "know" those people who aren't saved like he knew the prophets, or, since they aren't destined to be saved, are they just "extra's" in the show so to speak? (by "those not saved," I mean, who aren't saved after everything is done and finished, the ones God already knows won't be)


I suppose the gist of the OP would be, after 30 years with millions of Christians praying, and, no noticeable change in abortion policy, is God not answering because it is outside of His will, or, is it just part of what is meant to be? 30 years of prayer is a lot.

With that said, with God's order to man to replenish the earth (Gen 1:28), did he hand over the authority to man to dictate how he would do that? Did He leave it up to man to determine what is OK in this instance? It's obvious, none of those who God wants to be born and to be used here will be aborted, so, is everyone else, "extra" seeing that, more babies can be born to replace those not?

Anyway, those were some of my many questions. Lol.

hay brother jeff


its a tuff one as i tend to think deep like you

the way i see to what you wanted us to respond to is this


what support is there for the young mother or the young women that gets raped ? wil this benefit the young mother or the young women who was raped to were she decides not to end a childs life and accepts the child ?


i think god would see what goes on in our societys and he would weep for the ones who end a childs life


but the way the world is its accepted with out putting pressure on the women that decides to end the childs life that is growing in her womb


focus on the family has some awsem testimonys and i would encourage any one wondering what its like for a women to decide to end a childs life to go to the web site and take your time to go over what focus on the family offers also you can order the testimonys and the topics focus on the family discusses


people have a free will no matter what you might be feeling if a women decides to end a childs life who are we to judge her who are we to say its wrong for her to do this do the ones prottesting take the time to understand what the person has had to go threw before she made the choice those that protest wil they put what they preach into practise like giving aid to the young mother or to the young women that has been raped ?


i pray for commen sence more than sitting in on judgment on the women that decide to end a childs life


i know god hears our prayers and i know god answeres our prayers i have seen this in my life were god has made sure all my needs are meet not once have i gone with out i have also learnt that god wil answer our prayers in his own timming and he will put people around us


even though i know what the bible says on abortion i tend to stay clear from the flesh when the flesh takes over i just become like the protestors and i tend not to picket in front of abortion clinicks

i wil be living in a country were their is not much aid like what we have in Australia in the philippines if you have a child you have to do what ever you can to make sure your child survives

in Australia assistance is given to single mother and to couples living in defacto relationships this assistances is given by this department center link when a couple has a child for the first time they get $5,000 up to $7,000 to help them with what ever they need

in the philippines you do not get this assistance i have seen single mothers do what ever they can to make sure there childs needs are met our members are very poor when i was in the philippines early this year i was taken to a village that was made on a tip pastor jess holds serval bible studies threw the week i got the chance to know some of the members i was holding a baby and as i held this young child i senced their was something wrong the mother was very young she was doing her best to make sure her childs needs are meet the father works abroad and sends what he can i held the child close to me and when we finished the bible study i got the male pastor and asked the mother if it was ok if we prayed over the child i just simply prayed over this new born asking god to keep the child safe and i asked god to watch over the child and the parents


i was told they did not want the child but commen sence kicked in and they are doing their best for their little one



bringing up a child is very expensive i feel more for our members in the philippines than i do for the ones i know who are well off


with my fiancee being the head pastor and me marrying a single female pastor i know their wil be times were i wil be called to counsel a young mother who has decided to end a childs life my fiancee told me she often gets called to counsil young women who have decided they cant go on with the pregnacy she does not judge the ones that come to her or say its wrong she just listens and offers what ever support she can

i had to come before god and said lord this is a hard one and i am going to need your guidance lord help me to die to the flesh i do not want to take the side were i come and join the protestors that protest in front of abortion clinics i want to do what is right lord and i need your help

i could only respond to this by what i have been giving over to god



God bless from damo

--Edited out an inappropriate example for this thought--

A teenager makes a bad choice and has an unwed pregnancy...

An up-and-coming professional's pregnancy interferes with her plans...

A college student gets pregnant while drunk at a party...

The list goes on...

And the baby pays the price.

In Old Testament days, there was a convenient way to eliminate the little responsibilities. Sacrifice them to your god:

Leviticus 18:21
And thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Molech, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the LORD.

Deuteronomy 18:10
There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch.

Ezekiel 20:26
And I polluted them in their own gifts, in that they caused to pass through the fire all that openeth the womb, that I might make them desolate, to the end that they might know that I am the LORD.

Ezekiel 20:31
For when ye offer your gifts, when ye make your sons to pass through the fire, ye pollute yourselves with all your idols, even unto this day: and shall I be enquired of by you, O house of Israel? As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I will not be enquired of by you.

Ezekiel 23:37
That they have committed adultery, and blood is in their hands, and with their idols have they committed adultery, and have also caused their sons, whom they bare unto me, to pass for them through the fire, to devour them.

This is just a small sample of the verses in the Old Testament talking about killing children for our idols.

The only reason it is still going on in America is because God has mercifully withheld judgment, looking for repentance.

The day to pay up is rapidly approaching, just like it did for Israel.

May the Lord have mercy.

In Christ,

Mike

Mike,
I really like that perspective, but I must ask:

Since when has a woman getting raped 'an idol' ? You can't rape the willing and rape is against a person's will.. I understand the other 3, but not the first one....

I think, since that was the first item mentioned, that my thought process shifted and evolved as I was typing the post, without filtering out that first cause of an unwanted pregnancy as a possible exception. (I've edited the original post.)

No, the act of a woman getting raped is quite obviously not idolatry on her part.

As far as her "right" to terminate the pregnancy due to rape, I suppose that would have to be checked with scripture. At first thought, many would jump at that and give approval without considering the innocence of the baby, despite the origin of the pregnancy.

To say it would be difficult is an understatement.

As a man, to say that I understand the depth of it, would be presumptuous.

I would like to hear the opinion of a few Godly, elder women of the faith.

Thanks for pointing that out.

In Christ,

Mike

First: Not one of these little souls have been lost. The Creator that gave them a soul, has custody of them at this writing. Every one of them.

Secondly: While He hates this atrocity, he knows the things we can not know... regarding the painful and sorrowful repentance of some of the millions who partook in this. We, the Baby-Boom Generation, have lived most of our lives in a time of plenty in America. Some members of our generation are the ones who fought to make abortion legal, and then worked as hard as possible to justify it. (Not all of us) For many who seemed to have everything, God might have allowed this in order that they may see themselves as sinners...in need of a Saviour. I don't know this for sure, but I do know many people around my age, who actively sought out forgiveness, and looked for The Lord, because their conscience convicted them to a "Godly Sorrow."

I cannot call God on my phone and ask Him to verify my theory, but I have personally brought two women to Jesus for healing and eternal life. I have personally used the Holy Words of Grace and Mercy to help other women in my Bible classes to forgive themselves and lay this burdon at the feet of the greatest healer who ever walked on the Earth. I have personally comforted my own sister, who raised three kids to adulthood, as she sat out on her porch, staring in to space and said, "today, would have been my first-born's birthday."

Sharon,

You bring a good point to the table. Many women who have had abortions are not bad people; just confused and scar'd. These women deserve our attention and love and not our condemnation. These women need Grace/forgiveness shown towards them because so many of these women will not if ever, be able to forgive themselves. That's a heavy load of guilt to live under and in Christ we need to serve these women. In the process we may be able to save an innocent child.

Gods Blessings,

Al

I watched a commercial once that has always stuck in my mind. This was a Pro life commercial.

This nurse was talking and she said that she used to think it was a womans choice.

Then it dawned on her one day that there were times when a woman who was pregnant was having difficulties....they would do everything they could to save the babies life.

It was considered a LIFE then. (the mother wanted the baby).

But when the mother did NOT want the baby....people just called it a fetus and not a real human yet.

She said....."it just didn't make sense to me anymore".
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I think its murder. And if you don't want a child or don't think you can raise it...then give the baby up for adoption. Give the child a chance at life.

I know first hand how painful that is to give your child up for adoption.

But I have also counseled woman who have had abortions...and many are messed up for a very long time.

Wouldn't it be hard...to raise several kids that you adore and love, and every night as they sat around the dinner table, you knew in your heart, that one was missing..... who never committed any crime, who looked, acted, and had many of the same characteristics as the rest of the litter, and who should be sitting there right now? That would be so hard.

I think the testimony of many a brave woman who has greived over her decision, has saved more lives than we will probably ever know.

First of all, Jesus came to save sinners in the world, not to condemn the world. We are called to do the same. We are called to bring God's mercy and forgiveness to women and parents involved with abortions. But no mercy can truly be given if we fail to define what is right and wrong in God's word. God's true love will always tell the painful truth so that there may come real mercy and healing.

Don't re-name it "terminating a pregnancy." Humans are not lifeless, robotic and cold Terminators from the Terminator movies. It is called "killing a child."

Don't call him/her a "fetus." The word fetus is from the Latin fetus, meaning offspring, bringing forth, hatching of young. It has Indo-European roots related to sucking or suckling. In other words, fetus means child. Don't mask reality with technical words that ease people's consciences.


"Who am I to judge a woman who chose to terminate her pregnancy?" More truthfully put: "who am I to tell a woman it is wrong to kill her child?"
"Do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment.”John 7:24, Deut 16:18.
Both God at Mt Sinai and Jesus commanded that we do judge people with righteous judgment. Do not just focus on the passages that ease your conscience and excuse us from telling people what is right and wrong. God's word is right. We are called to proclaim the truth of God's word.

I have four children of my own. I can tell you that I would have liked to adopt children but do not have the money. That is an upsidown governmental system that was established long ago. Check out the facts. Certain political groups (almost all are one certain party) protect their money making abortion industry. A poor, inner city, uneducated young woman can afford an abortion more easily than good parents can afford to save that child's life and adopt it. That is unjust.

What about incest?
It is simply not true that the child born of incest is likely to be deformed. Again, check the facts. An imperfect child is a living soul, a child of God none the less. Incest is a terrible crime. Punish the criminals, not the innocent children conceived.
Also, to argue about abortion over the incest issue is around less than 1% of abortion cases. The other 95% or more are a matter of convenience, "abortion on demand" cases are what worry me much more.

What about rape? Again, punish the criminal, not the innocent child involved. No matter how devestating and tragic the situation is with the woman, a life is a life and that can not change in any circumstance. Change the laws to make adoption easier than killing the poor baby. Set up the system to discourage unwanted pregnancy and encourage parenting and responsibility (common sense here). I guarantee you that if abortion was outlawed, most of those "unwanted" pregnancies would stop happening real fast. Force irresponsable parents to take responsibility and they will somehow stop getting pregnant so often. Rape pregnancies account for less than 1% of abortions.

The church needs to be embrace a culture of life. This means that a tradition of adopting. Christian orphanages would be a common phenomenon in the church. So much good would come of this. Imagine how much racial healing the America would experience over time if many of the white Christians would begin to adopt so many of the black babies that would have otherwise been aborted. How I wish I could do this today! The early church ended up outlawing abortion/infant exposure back in Roman times. The church started up the first orphanages. Christians would rescue infants legally abandoned for the animals and weather to kill (infant exposure). Life is from God. "So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin." James 4:17.

Excellent!! Is there a pro-life website that will publish this brilliant essay of yours? Thank you, I'm in total agreement, especially the part of using abortion as birth control.

This really is a deep topic...and it is hard to understand why bad things are allowed to happen (especially to children). This goes beyond just abortion, but the sexual abuse and so much more horrific things that happen.

A few months back our Pastor did a message that basicly covered how the worldview has humans reduced to being just another "animal" not unique human creature above all animals. And along those lines a developing baby is not that...but a fetus...so abortion is then not considered "murder" (although it is).

Sadly, there are many studies that show woman do suffer long term emotional effects of this decision and only God can deal with their hearts. Above all, God uses all situations to his glory...and I know some women who previously made this choice to now cousel young women, work at centers opposing abortion and much more.

While there are many who pray for this to be stopped, when it's time to get voting done...I believe many Christians are absent from that responsibility. It's hard to imagine we are a country where 80% (or some approx high number) of the people "claim" to be Christians yet this is not seen through the voting. I was shocked that the last round of voting (here in CA) - parental notification of a minor child seeking an abortion was NOT PASSED. Even if you are not a Christian, how would parents in general NOT vote that they be informed??

OK - I will step off the soap box now and just say all we can do is just continue in prayer...and let God deal with the judgement.

Amen.

Pray and also add voting pro-life wheels to your prayer.

You made some good points, and what's sadder still, are the conditions and background that caused those women to abort those babies in the first place. God forbid sex before marriage in order to protect women and innocent children. These laws were not to prohibit fun, but to protect women from being used by irresponsible males. In God's order, men are supposed to protect women and provide for them so they can be at home raising the next generation. Look at all of the single moms who have been left to raise kids on thier own, while the "Peter Pans" are out partying and looking for welfare moms to move in with. Then they turn around and brag about all the kids they have... that they are not paying child support for.

That's not all, people married young in earlier civilizations, and had more responsibility at a younger age. We live in a society where people don't marry until they are much older, and are kept in a dependent state far longer than previous generations. We also are a very judgemental society (what will the nieghbors think, what will the church people think, etc.) when we should be concentrating on the mental and physical state of our own... and that includes their "mistakes."

Very good and pertinent points. Never looked at it quite that way.

Very good point... but.....

Does that mean women should just stay at home with the kids? No aspirations for a career means no drinking at college parties, no climbing corporate ladders, etc....

look at the politics of greed...

families are torn apart because of the toll of two incomes
needed...and still not making it and chilren in tow.

the culture of Babylon says discard this and get that.
we live in a "desposable" minded society that puts little
value on life...

the women are as much victims of bondage as the
babies they murder.

Pray that the Lord will touch the lives of these women
and that they will pass by the clinic and turn to Christ,
saving two lives...may this happen and doctors
convicted in the hearts walk away from the office
broken and broke.

deep calls to deep

may those asleep wake up and live unto Christ.
amen

Many of us never had that priveledge....

Speaking of unanswered prayers i have noticed that God always wants us to step forth and do what we can before He takes over.
King David had to confront Goliath in the name of the Lord before Goliath could be defeated. God could have taken Goliath out anytime
that He wanted. When we move forward in the will of God then God moves before us making sure we are successful.
Most times God wants human vessels to be the answer to our own prayers... we bring Glory to God the Father and Christ when we are
victorious in His name.

taltimbr

God told me once, "I will not do what you can do."

Thanks Tall Timbers: yer awesome! I like this and I have never thought of things from this angle.

Wow. That's pretty deep Larry. I suppose He wouldn't!

Very good food for thought. TY.

Hence the need to stay in Jesus:

John 15:5
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

He is either always in control, or he is not. No control = no fruit.

In Christ,

Mike