For years< I believed that we would not know the identity of the anti-christ on this side of the rapture........but now I am having second thoughts with good reason........................But before I go any farther,...I believe that when the 7 year covenant has been confirmed, the Sanhedrin in Israel will proclaim this man that comes out of Europe as their long awaited messiah............That they will not realize this man to be the anti-christ until the Abomination of Desolation had come to pass.................It is possible for the Bride to know the Identity of the ac before the rapture comes to pass..........Scripture reveals that the ac will be of jewish lineage.............And he must be of jewish lineage for the Sanhedrin to believe that he is their messiah...........with that said.....I have been suspicious of the newly elected French president as to being the ac from the word go when he became elected....keep in mind that the french president himself probally does not know at this time that he is destined as to being the ac fore told in bible prophecy.......At the 62nd united nations session.....he called for a one world government, and also called for the earth to become broken up into 10 global regions......he has also stated that he will lead Europe into a new era of peace and prosperity.........The Israelis have said that he is a fresh new wind for the middle east peace negotiations, and that he is the only one that they trust in Europe....He is of jewish lineage...........The European Union Parliment consists of 27 nations, and there has been talk of dissolving 17 of those nations from it's parliment, and giving power over to only 10 of those nations...................We all have front row seats.....Stay tuned!............................................................benny

Just a quick question, I read that this man of lawlessness will worship a god of fortresses that neitheir his father nor his ancestors have known, does the French President worship a god of fortresses in some way?

Dear Flyingsquirrel,...I cannot say just yet....I know that he is divorced, and that scriptures staes that he will not have any regard for women....I would not know if that would qualify, but I am still observing this guy...........In the "What Do You Say" section.....under the topic" Report: Sarkozy Wants Blair As Eu's President, Most like not Blair....But who?...Will the ac step forward?"....in post number 4......I have posted a biography on him....There maybe a hint there......................benny

Where exactly in the Bible is this said?

I've heard that all 4 of Sarkozy's grandparents were immigrants to France (what on earth were they thinking?), so Sarkozy isn't an ethnic Frenchman. But, I haven't heard before now that he has Jewish ancestry. But apparently his mother had a Sephardic Jewish ancestry by way of Greece and Spain and 57 members of her family were murdered by the Germans.

I cannot believe that the French elected him since he is not French and is Jewish. Historically the French have been extremely chauvinistic about all things French and the French have always been as anti-Semitic as the Germans ever were.



I hadn't heard this. If Sarkozy is ever diagnosed with something like cancer or if he is ever wounded in an assassination attempt, thus the deadly wound (Revelation 13:3), Sarkozy should get greater securitization. Otherwise I would look for someone who is born on October 31. Considering the commercial similarities between Halloween and Christmas, I wouldn’t be bit surprised if the Antichrist celebrates his birthday on Halloween and Halloween will completely replace Christmas once the Antichrist is in power.

Napoleon wasn't French

Napoleon was a Corsican of Italian ancestry. But the French didn't elect Napoleon emperor/dictator and I don't think he had been elected consul in a general election either.

daniel 11;38.....in part that states..."and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honor with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things."
notice the words "a god whom his fathers knew not ".......It is these words that reveal that he will be of jewish lineage...............................benny

Dear Flaja,...read post 49....at... ' http://www.christian-forum.net/index.php?s...amp;st=45" benny ...ps gotta go to work... i'll help you with the rest later

Daniel chapter 11 could just as easily be talking about Antiochus Epiphanes and Ptolemy at the time of the Maccabean revolt. As far as I know there is no power south of modern day Israel that could pick a fight with the Antichrist and thus be the King of the South. Antiochus and Ptolemy both had a portion of Alexander the Great’s empire; there were roughly evenly match in power and were both world powers in their day.



The only aid that Israel needs to give Abbas is measuring him for his shroud.

I don’t know that it is a good use of our resources to try to guess who the Antichrist may be. We have trouble enough convincing people, even self-proclaimed Christians, that the Christ is who He claims to be.

I have done some philosophy - and I don´t know for sure - but this is what I have so far, and please understand that it is only my oppinion:

Seal One - Napeopeon - White Horse - Victory - The First World Order - The first horseman


Seal Two - G.W. Bush - Red Horse - Failure - Chaos - The Second Horseman - King of (Mystery)Babylon


Seal Three - V. Putin - Black Horse - Growing Economy - He will bid for grain - The Third Horseman


Seal Four - Death because what the second and third horsemen did

Why don't you look into your IMAM AL MAHDI?

1.) Muslims primary messiah figure
2.) He will be a descendant of Muhammad and will bear Muhammad's name.
3.) He will be a very devout Muslim
4.) He will be a spiritual, political, and military world leader
5.) He will emerge after a period of great turmoil and suffering upon the earth from the well (his pit of hell)
6.) He will be the CALIPH and the IMAM of the Muslims worldwide
7.) He will lead a world revolution and establish a new world order
8.) He will invade many countries.
9.) He will make a SEVEN-YEAR peace treaty with a Jew of priestly lineage.
10.) He will conquer Israel for Islam and lead the "faithful Muslims" in a final slaugher/battle against the Jews and Christians (take a good look at 2 MILLION killed in DARFUR!)
11.) He will establish the new Islamic world headquarters from Jerusalem.
12.) He will rule for SEVEN YEARS
13.) He will cause Islam to be the only religion practice on the earth
14.) He will appear riding a white horse
15.) He will discover some previously undiscovered biblical manuscripts that he will use to argue with the Jews and cause them to convert to Islam
16.) He will also re-discover the Ark of the Covenant from the Sea of Galilee, which he will bring to Jerusalem.
17.) He will have supernatural poer from -alaah over the wind and the rain and the crops
18.) He will possess and distribute enormous amounts of wealth.
19.) He will be loved by all people of the earth

Including you Togarma~!

I would say that the White Horseman represents the Gospel being taken to the entire world. It wouldn't be just to bring on the judgments of the other horsemen before an opportunity for redemption is given.

The Black Horseman respresents famime, not a growing economy.

Revelation 6:6 And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine.

The word that the AKj translates as penny is denarius, which was a Roman coin that represented a day's wage for the working class. Thus it will take everything you can earn to buy just the minimum amount of food needed to stay alive.

Well isn't interesting how this MAHDI:

Izzat and Arif then go on to say:

"It is clear that this man is the Mahdi who will ride the WHITE HORSE and judge by the Qu'ran (with justice)and with whom will be men with marks of prostration on their foreheads [Marks on their foreheads from bowing in prayer with their head to the ground five times daily]"

Now tell me so according to Islam eschatology their Jesus (Isa) will:

THIS IS THE ISLAMIC JESUS (ISA):
1.) Jesus (Isa) is said to return to the earth in the last days near a mosue in Damascus.
2.) Jesus will arrive at a time when the Mahdi and his army will be preparing to pray.
3.) Jesus will be offered to lead the prayer by the Mahdi, but will decline in direct deference to the Mahdi who Jesus declares to be the leader of the Muslims
4.) Jesus will then pray behind the Mahdi as a subordinate.
5.) Jesus will be a faithful Muslim
6.) Jesus will make a pilgrimage to Mecca
7.) Jesus will visit Muhammad's grave, and salute Muhammad, whereby Muhammad will return the salute from the grave.
8.) Jesus will come back and break all crosses
9.) Jesus will destroy Christianity
10.) Jesus will repeal the jizah tax causing the only option for Jews and Christians being to convert to Islam or die
11.) Jesus will establish Islamic Sharia Law throughout the entire earth
12.) Jesus will kill the Antichrist and his followers made up largely of Jews and women.
13.) Jesus will remain on earth for roughly forty years, during which he will marry, have children and then die

The "his fathers" refer to the King of the North, not Israel. I still don's see how this can refer to the AC as Jewish.
Even more so when Daniel 7 refers to the Little Horn [antichrist] as coming up among the 10 horns [kings] that result from dividing the kingdom of the 4th beast, Rome [fourth beast/ nation]. It is generally accepted that the for beasts of Daniel 7 are parallel to the 4 kingdoms of Daniel 2; Babylon, Medo Persia, Greece and Rome. If the 10 horns result from the division of Rome who is the fourth beast, and the little horn arises among the ten, I don't see how the Little horn can be Jewish?
3am

I AGREE 3AM,

Let me quote you again,

3AM SAYS:

Right on Flaja!
White is never a symbol for anything except purity.
Jesus rides the White horse in Revelation 19.
The White horse more likely symbolizing the early success of the Gospel going to the world (Col 1:6) before God can Judge who who who does not accept it. I think it is important to keep the book of Revelation Christ Centered!!! (Revelation 1:1)
Great insight!

"All over the world this gospel is bearing fruit and growing, just as it has been doing among you since the day you heard it and understood God's grace in all its truth" (Colossians 1:6).
3am

Yes, I understand that, but someone is holding the weight - and that can only mean that someone will earn a pretty wage - and it is the Black horseman.

I figured that Russia has a growing economy, and is buying bits and pieces of what is left on the food-market, making the prices on wheat and barley reaching skyhigh levels and basicly enforce a wheat and barley crisis that seems to go out of porporsjon.

As I mention, it is my oppinion, and I am still working on the subject.

As for the White Horseman, If God is with him it must represent a future warrier who God gave victory to.

And there is nobody but Napoleon who has had a world war and had victory. He established peace on earth, a peace that lasted untill the first world war, which broke the Napolean World Order. But First world war was a failiure, and second world war was a mistake, Hitler failed his mission.

Ever since the 1. world war there has been a war going on somewhere in the world, and America has been a provider of weapons ever since the 2. world war.

Someone had to start the 3. world war, which started in Iraq - and it was all based on a lie that made a powershift and gave Iran the upper hand, which Ahmadinejad uses to gather everyone to the Gog-Magog war - And only time will show when the first super-power presses the atomic button - and when that happends - we will perish, our flesh will burn, we will feel pain and go to heaven.

As i said, I am still researching the subject.

Iran have made alliance with:

Russia
China
Kirgistan
Turkmenistan
Kazakstan
Syria
Venezuela

The question is not how, it is when - and that is why I believe G.W. Bush is the 2. horseman - he started what will be WW3.

Now, what do you make of this?

No, it does not. The words, "elohei avotav" literally means "gods (plural) of his fathers". It does not unambiguously indicate the God of the Bible.

Please see this article: http://al-mahdi.atspace.com/jewishantichrist.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antichrist
Some read Jesus as hinting that the Antichrist would be Jewish by his statement: "I have come in My Father's name, and you do not receive Me; if another comes in his own name, you will receive him ..." John 5:43.





of tribes being absent from similar lists, without any iniquity being implied. It is probable that such is the case here.

Jerry Falwell believed that the Antichrist would be of Jewish descent, basing their claims on Daniel 11:37. This verse reads: "Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all".[2] Some [citation needed]hold that disregarding "... the desire of women ..." may indicate that the Antichrist will be a celibate or a homosexual, however in Jewish tradition, "... the desire of women ..." is to bear children, so that Daniel describes the Antichrist's hatred towards his own children or his refusal to have children of his own. Some read Jesus as hinting that the Antichrist would be Jewish by his statement: "I have come in My Father's name, and you do not receive Me; if another comes in his own name, you will receive him ..." John 5:43.

[edit] In Islam

Antichrist is similar to the description of dajjal who will appear as a powerful and corrupt leader and Isa (Arabic name for Jesus Christ) will kill him in an epic war near Jerusalem.

What must be realized is that the Sanhedrin will not proclaim anyone as the messiah, unless he is of jewish decent...there will not be any exceptions......also the guy on the white horse of revelation 6 is the anti-christ.....scriptures point out that he will destroy many thru peace.....the rider on this white horse has a crown given to him.......in revelation 19....you will notice that the Lord Jesus has many crowns..also,white does not alway imply purity.......satan can come to one as an angle of light..................................benny

check out this link.............http://judicial-inc.biz/s.,.Sarkozy_considers_israel_his_rea.htm

.........................................benny

That would make Revelation a book of history and not a book of prophecy.

Since history repeats....History IS prophecy

[quote name='togarma' date='Nov 5 2007, 10:40 PM' post='128536']
Yes, I understand that, but someone is holding the weight - and that can only mean that someone will earn a pretty wage - and it is the Black horseman.[/quote]

If there is famine in the land someone's extravagant wage won't matter because there will be little food to buy. If the person holding the scale has to pay 0.99 penny for something that he can only resale for 1.0 penny, the seller's wage will be nothing.
[quote]I figured that Russia has a growing economy, and is buying bits and pieces of what is left on the food-market, making the prices on wheat and barley reaching skyhigh levels and basicly enforce a wheat and barley crisis that seems to go out of porporsjon.[/quote]

I would venture that Red China's economy is growing at a faster rate than Russia's is.

[quote'And there is nobody but Napoleon who has had a world war and had victory.[/quote]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Surrend..._Cornwallis.jpg

John Trumbull’s painting of Cornwallis’ surrender at Yorktown depicts George Washington on a white horse.

Napoleon was defeated at Waterloo and died in exile on the island of Elba in the south Atlantic.

[quote]He established peace on earth, a peace that lasted untill the first world war,[/quote]

He did no such thing.

War with the Barbary Pirates, 1801-1805 (or 1801 to the present if you consider the Barbary Pirates to be Islamic terrorists)

Russo-Prussian War, 1804-1813

War of 1812, 1812-1815

Mexican-American War, 1846-1848

Crimean War, 1854-1856

American Civil War, 1861-1865

Austro-Prussian War, 1866

Franco-Prussian War, 1870-1871

First Boer War, 1880-1881

Spanish-American War, 1898

Second Boer War, 1899-1902

Russo-Japanese War, 1904-1905

And then throw in a large assortment of civil wars, Indian wars, wars of independence and rebellions. The century between Napoleon’s defeat at Waterloo and World War I was not at all peaceful.

[quote]Someone had to start the 3. world war, which started in Iraq - and it was all based on a lie that made a powershift and gave Iran the upper hand, which Ahmadinejad[/quote]

We now have U.S. military forces on two sides of Iran- three if you count the U.S. Navy in the Persian Gulf.

"Neither shall he regard ... the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women,

Then you know that he won't be a Frenchman.



This tells me that the Antichrist will likely not be Jewish. Hebrew tradition holds that when a Jewish man dies the first 3 questions that he is asked in Heaven is 1. Did you study the Torah? 2. Did you trade in good faith? and 3. Did you father children? Jews place such emphasis on producing children that any Jew who does not would likely be treated as a pariah.

BTW: Sarkozy has 3 children.



Where in the Bible does it say that the Messiah has to have the Sanhedrin’s approval? I don’t think that the Sanhedrin even existed when Isaiah’s messianic prophecies were made, and the Sanhedrin doesn’t exist now- one need not be Jewish to vote for (or serve in?) the Israeli Parliament.

Not necessarily.

If you look at it from the point of time in which it was written, those things which were future to the church could be in the past for us in the present time. If the seven churches, for example, as many believe represent, not only seven literal churches present at the time of writing, also represent seven periods in the history of the church, then some of that time must necessarily be past for us yet future to them. [plese dont confuse this with the extreme view of preterists who place it all i the future.]
That means that one of the tasks of interpreting Revelation would be to determine which portion is past and which portion yet remains to be fulfilled in our future. Even more important is the need to discover where the cross is located in some prophecies. For example, the woman in Revelation 12 would be symbolic of God's people, National Israel, if she came before the cross, but after the cross, God's people are the church, so she would at that point symbolize the church. The phrase, "the woman who had given birth to the male child" should be understood as God's people after the cross, therefore the church. Jesus and the cross become the norm for understanding the book of Revelation, which should not be surprising since it begins with those very words, "The Revelation of Jesus Christ."

Revelation is a letter from Jesus to His church from the beginning to the end.
Rev 1:1 The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, 2who testifies to everything he saw—that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ.

22:16"I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star."

Even though the book is couched in very Jewish language, we shouldn't let that overshadow the fact that the entire letter is the testimony of Jesus for his church.
The introductory vision of the book, Jesus standing among the seven lampstands, sounds very much like the Jewish temple, since the seven lamp stands were fixture in the Holy Place. However, Jesus himself interprets the seven lampstands as the 7 churches. This makes perfect sense, since Hebrews points to Jesus as our, the churches' High Priest serving in the temple in Heaven! Heb 8:1ff
3am

If the White Horseman represents the early success of the Gospel, then Revelation has to be a book of history since the early success of the Gospel had already happened by the time Revelation was written.

Not the whole book! Good night, the rider on the white horse is only one verse. If my premise is right, then that verse would be history. It would reflect the early victory of the Gospel. Then comes the red horse, depicting persecution which rapidly moved into the church.
The fact that one part of the book might be history, doesnt mean the entire book is a history.
God can reach back in the visions to relate historical facts, which might help cast light on the future.
It seems a little odd to me to claim that the book of Revelation written to the church would have very little to say to the church.
3am

For the last 33 years, I have believed that the beast system is communism. I know that many people believe that communism has gone by the wayside, but read what is in the communist paper Pravda, today.

Long Live the Revolution!





The goal of communism has always been and still is today for there to be socialism worldwide. A one world government. Is there any other system of government openly striving for a one world government, with the military means to do it? The only thing stopping world communism has been the military might of the US. If that was gone Who could stand against the combined militaries of Russia and China and their allies? If you read the communists own writings, they are very much against God. Standard operating procedure is to close churches and arrest religious leaders. Even today, Christians are being persecuted in communist countries, even with their more liberal face. Did you know that Gorbachev never resigned as the leader of the soviet union? He simply said, at the time, I choose not to perform the duties of the leader of the Soviet Union. Communists leaders never step down. At a moments notice, with a word, he could recreate the soviet union. Gorbachev was the 7th leader of the soviet union. If the Soviet Union was to be reborn, he would be the 8th. Of the 7 and an 8th. He has no love for women. A red dragon, red is the symbol of communism. He is a man a peace, a nobel prize winner. His name means, "one who is like God" and he has compared himself to both God and Jesus.

Revelation 13
3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

This is a description of Gorbachev, his head looks like it was wounded to death and healed. It also describes the Soviet Union and a miraculous rebirth.

Revelation 13
11And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
12And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

I believe this refers to Putin who pretends to be a lamb but speaks like a dragon. He exercised the power of Gorbachev who was before him. I also believe he is preparing to step down, to make way for Gorbachev and the rebirth of the Soviet Union and the goal of world socialism.

Gorbachev quotes:

This approach is perceived as a claim to a messianic role, as an illusion, that is negatively. But let us not forget that many [movements] which began as a heresy subsequently conquered the world.

"Jesus was the first socialist, the first
to seek a better life for mankind."

"I believe, as Lenin said,
that this revolutionary
chaos may yet crystallize
into new forms of life."

I can repeat to my dear fellow party members. I have never
no matter before what audience experienced any shame in
saying that I am a communist and committed to the socialist idea.

Gorbachev wrote "The Earth Charter"
First, the charter indicates we would live under Socialism, as one of its goals is to "promote the equitable distribution of wealth within nations and among nations."
Commenting on the spiritual nature of the charter, Gorbachev in a Los Angeles Times interview said: "My hope is that this charter will be a kind of Ten Commandments, a 'Sermon on the Mount,' that provides a guide for human behavior toward the environment in the next (21st) century and beyond." And charter co-sponsor Maurice Strong similarly remarked: "The real goal of The Earth Charter is that it will in fact become like the Ten Commandments."

If the White Horseman represents the early success of the Gospel, something that had already happened, why point out something that was already obvious?

And why would there be a 2000 year gap between the 1st horseman and the 2nd, 3rd and 4th? If the White Horseman represents history, how can you be so certain that the other 3 horsemen as well as the entire book of Revelation don’t likewise represent history and not prophecy? How are we supposed to know the difference?

Gorbachev is almost 77 years old. I doubt that anyone is thinking of him as a world leader.

He's young compared to Reagan. No one suspects him, but has any world leader written an internationally recognized global constitution?

Dear Flaja,..You State..."Where in the Bible does it say that the Messiah has to have the Sanhedrin’s approval? I don’t think that the Sanhedrin even existed when Isaiah’s messianic prophecies were made, and the Sanhedrin doesn’t exist now- one need not be Jewish to vote for (or serve in?) the Israeli Parliament.".......I am not trying to be disrespectful......but from reading your posts, it seems that you are not very well informed about events......first of all.....The Sanhedrin are very much back in Israel.....Also you really need to get off the white horse/gospel combo....it shows that you are really out there in left field......Just so that you know....The ten toes of Daniel are already here, and have been here for awhile...The evidence of the above is on this forum, just do a search......I would help you with this but I am working nights for awhile and at this time I cannot give you my undivided attention.......Flaja,...Your state of "Where in the Bible does it say that the Messiah has to have the Sanhedrin’s approval".....Pray that the Lord gives you the gift of discernment, because it is very obvious that you have not this gift..................benny

He's almost as old as Reagan was when Reagan left office.

All of this blather but no answer the simplest of questions?

It is obvious that I have ruffled your feathers, and that you are not willing too do the research..........I find that very sad...and I do hope that you will reconsider......................benny

The Sanhedrin does exist, here's their webpage.

The Sanhedrin

All you have done is make yourself look foolish. You made a simple statement. I asked a simple question regarding the source of your statement and you responded with an insulting tirade.

The U.S. Constitution says nothing about the seating arrangement of either House of Congress.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanhedrin#Att...edrin_in_Israel

“Since the dissolution of the Sanhedrin in 358 AD, there has been no universally recognized authority within Jewoish Law.”

The current “Sanhedrin” has no legal authority.

Furthermroe, the Sanhedrin has no Biblical authority. It did not exist until well after the time at which God had had the Babylonians depose the last king of Judah. It was created during the period between the OT and NT. And the last time the Sanhedrin had any dealings with a Messiah, they had Him crucified.

Dear Flaja,.....Go to the "Signs Of The Times" section for starters........................Under the topic called"Daniel 9;27, Events leading to this prophecy"............Pour yourself a cup of coffee, cause you got a lot of reading to do.........If you have questions after studying ........I believe that I can answer your questions............Let us both not get off on the wrong foot.............................................benny

So you still cannot or will not give a simple answer to a simple question. Where is the Bible does it say that the Messiah has to have the Sanhedrin's approval? Answer: No where because the Sanhedrin is unbiblical.

You are substituting the doctrines of man for the content of the Bible.

a Good Historical reference point. The point of the book of Revelation is to Reveal Christ and his body (the church).
The problem with dispensationalism is that by putting a 2000 year gap between the 70h week and the 69th week, they are forced to take a position in Revelation that leaves out the Gospel and the church.
There is no gap. That is a myth forced into the Bible by dispensationalists. The 70 weeks of years mean just that 70 weeks of years. A time period in the Bible is always exactly that, a continuous time period. You cannot stick 2000 years in between the 69th week and the 70th week and still call it 70 weeks.

The prophecy is a Messianic Prophecy.
Israel as a nation had 70 weeks of years to accept Christ.
He came and fulfilled every one of the 6 items listed in Daniel 9:24 for Israel.
He made atonement for sin, ushered in everlasting righteousness, etc.
They Rejected Him and crucified him.
Their probation is over.
When he left the temple for the last time, he said "your house is left unto you desolate."
As opposed to the first time, when he said, "you have made "My Father's House" a den of thieves.
The nation of Israel is no Longer the chosen nation.
The remnant of Israel is the new Israel in Christ! (Romans 11:1ff) It even included Paul himself.
The Shikina Glory (presence of God) is no longer in the temple.
Jesus is now High priest in the temple in Heaven (Heb 8:1ff)
The book of Revelation begins with a snapshot of Jesus standing in heaven among the 7 Candlesticks.
They are furnishings in the temple in heaven. Revelation always talks about the temple in heaven.
The heavenly temple is where Christ serves the church.

That is why the seals reveal a history of the church, some past, some present, and into the future.
That is why we have to study to determine what is past, present and future.
But the key to understanding Revelation is Jesus, not Israel.
Not to belittle Israel, but she means nothing without Jesus.
I think is is sad to leave Jesus, His church and the Gospel out of Revelation.
3am

When Revelation was written Christ had only been born about 100 earlier and Christianity had only been around for about 70 years. In a region whose recorded history went back about 4,000 years, the White Horseman could not have served as a historical reference point because the 100 year history of Christianity at that time would have been a current event.



Huh? I’ve already said that I think the White Horseman represents the Gospel being taken to the entire world so how does Revelation leave out the Gospel?



The gap is a fact of history. If the White Horseman represents the spread of the Gospel to the entire world, then Revelation is entirely a book of prophecy because the Gospel has not yet been taken to the entire world.



Then why didn’t the world end in around 33 AD? My understanding is that the 69th week ended with the birth/crucifixion/resurrection of Christ. So if the 70 weeks were continuous, they would have long since ended, so why hasn’t the world followed suit.

Then why didn’t the world end in around 33 AD? My understanding is that the 69th week ended with the birth/crucifixion/resurrection of Christ. So if the 70 weeks were continuous, they would have long since ended, so why hasn’t the world followed suit..........................................................................................................................................................The reason is because the 70 weeks represents a 490 year period decreed to the jewish race by God......To basicly stop sinning,and anoint the most Holy....Basicly, from the going forth of the command to rebuild Jerusalem unto the cutting off of the Messiah would be a period of 69 weeks which represents a period of 483 years, which is 7 years short of completing the 490 decree , which the 7 year countdown begins with Daniel 9;27....when the 7 year covenant has been confirmed by the anti-christ.......Just prior to the cruxifiction of our Lord Jesus on the Cross of Calvary......the Mosiac Law was in effect...and it was the Sanhedrin who paid the soldgiers to tell a lie about the body of the Lord Jesus......But when the Lord Gave up his spirit on the cross....it was almost as if time stopped in a sense..........the first 2000 yrs. of time was without the law......the second period of 2000 yrs. was with the Mosiac Law......the third period of 2000 yrs is under the period of Grace of which "WE" are now living under......Once the Rapture comes to pass....that period of Grace will be over pertaining to the Bride of Jesus Christ....And then shortly there after the 7 year covenant will be confirmed....when Daniels 70th week begins, in a sense, it will be almost as if time picked up where it left off at the cruxifiction and this 7 years of Daniel will complete the 70 weeks decreed towards the Jewish race.......Since the scriptures state that in the days of these 10 kings that give their power over to the beast.....(The beast is a system, a way of rule, and yet again it is a man)...At that time, Scriptures point out that the Ancient Of Days will sit.Once the rapture happens it will be a whole new ballgame if you will............Russia and the Islamic nations will be destroyed militarily, but not as a people, and there will be no one who would dare stop Israel from building the third Temple....At that Time the Mosiac Law will be strongly observed and the Sanhedrin will have much power concerning the temple mount for the first 3 1/2 years only! But not the second half!.........This man who confirms the 7 year covenant, the Sanhedrin will proclaim him as their long awaited messiah....at that time he has not yet been revealed to the jewish race as to what his true colors are.....But at the beginning of the second half of Daniels 70th week at the Abomination Of Desolation....it is this act in itself that reveals the anti-chist as to whom he really is and the Jews flee into the wilderness......Considering that the E.U. are at this time talking about disolving 17 nations out of their parliment and giving power over to 10 E. U. nations.....then it seems that we all do not have very much time to wait for the rapture......even though the negotiation on the status of Jerusalem and the temple mount will be on the table near the end of this mount, I think that no final agreement will be made .....at least not yet......I think that the pot will boil worse because of no agreement, which would lead to Isaiah 17;1...........God would not destroy Sodom until Lot and his family were out of harms way....and I believe that there are many christians in Damascus......For this reason and also in combination of current signs....I believe that there is a strong possibility that the rapture may come to pass very very soon.....Our wait will not be long..........................................benny

My understanding is that missionaries have been sent to every country in the world. Can you name a country where the gospel has not been preached?

Another interesting note about Gorbachev, his family name is Gogrbachev before it was westernized. Where have I heard that name before? Oh, I know, wasn't there a Gog prince of Rosh?

Can you document that the Gospel has been taken to all countries? Back in the 1990s there was talk of the 10-40 Window, that is the region of the earth between 10 degrees north latitude and 40 degrees north latitude in the Eastern Hemisphere where there has yet to be any significant missionary activity. Some 2/3 of the world’s total population including most of the world’s Islamic, Hindu and Buddhist population live in this region. Many of the national governments in this region are hostile to Christianity either overtly or covertly.



There is no standard for transliterating Russian into English. A word in Russian can have multiple spellings in English- Czar and Tsar for example. There’s not really such a thing as westernized and the Russian word that you render as Gogrbachev in the English alphabet could likely have many different spellings in English.

I can tell that you have spent much time studying and researching this prophecy. I always enjoy dialogue with people that have some deeper knowledge of the issues.
First of all, to answer the question as to why the wold did end in around 33 AD? the list of things given in verse 24 which are to be accomplished during the 70 year period does not include the end of the world.
"Seventy 'weeks' are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy."

In verse 24, "atone for wickedness" is one of the things done within the 70 weeks.
That can only be referring to Jesus and the cross. That means that Jesus must atone for wickedness within the 70 week period.

Secondly: Verse 25 clearly says that there would be 69 weeks from the decree until the Messiah comes. Messiah is Hebrew for Anointed One. So there would be 69 weeks until the Anointed one or Messiah is anointed for ministry. One of my basic principles is to let the NT be the final interpreter of the Bible, especially Jesus. I think it is significant that Jesus was baptized in 27 AD, exactly 493 years after the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem. And even more significant is His statement just after being baptized, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel (Mark 1:15)."

Third point: Verse 26 says he would be cut off AFTER the 69th week. But it does not say exactly when yet. That places it within he 70th week. Only later does the text actually place the crucifixion in the middle of the 70th week when Jesus put an end to Sacrifice and offerings and the vail in the temple was torn from top to bottom.

Here is the main problem with the view that the 70th week is yet future: If Jesus comes at the END of the 69 weeks, and then is cut off AFTER the 69th week, and His atonement would take place WITHIN the 70 weeks, then He would have to have been crucified DURING the 70th week.
So how can we be between the 69th week and the 70th week, if Jesus was to make atonement for sin in the 70th week. That seems to be taking away the centrality and focus of the cross.

I think it is a serious mistake to focus the 70th week on a future antichrist when it should be focused on Jesus! In fact this whole prophecy is about Jesus. Look again at every item listed in verse 24. Only Jesus can accomplish those things. His people can only accomplish them IN HIM.

Please show me just one verse that mentions a time span of a specific number of years like the 70 weeks / 490 years, which breaks it up with a gap. The natural reading of "Seventy weeks are decreed" means 70 continuous weeks. No where in scripture does the bible mention a specific time period and then have it mean something else, broken up with a gap. The burden of proof is on the one trying to say that the Bible means something different from what it says naturally.
If a father were to tell his son he would spend 70 minutes with him, he doesnt mean a minute a day for 70 days. Or a minute a year for 70 years. Where does the Bible explain that 70 weeks does not mean 70 continuous weeks?
I realize that this is radically different from most stuff out there but you don't seem like the type who would blow something off because it is different. If something is true, it doesn't matter how different it is, right. The test is, does it measure up to Scripture.
God Bless
3am

My apologies.
I had forgotten your view of the white horse.
You are correct. Keep Jesus and the Gospel center.
We still have a little ways to go on the 70 weeks.
Sometimes it gets difficult to keep up with who is saying what and each year it gets more difficult.

I already posted some answers in a reply to Bennie.
Disregard the part about the white horse.
3am

Dear 3 am,...The following quote was Flaja's statement not my own......."Then why didn’t the world end in around 33 AD? My understanding is that the 69th week ended with the birth/crucifixion/resurrection of Christ. So if the 70 weeks were continuous, they would have long since ended, so why hasn’t the world followed suit.".....Also When the command to rebuild Jerusalem was given.....it was 483 years to the exact day when the Lord Jesus was cuttoff(Cruxified)......Also the day that the Lord road into Jerusalem on a little donkey, was on april 6th, 32ad.....that was the day of their visitaion..............................................benny