Full Version: Two Witnesses
hypothetically speaking what would your tests be to determine the authenticity of a witness?
QUOTE(enok @ Jul 9 2005, 07:30 AM)
hypothetically speaking what would your tests be to determine the authenticity of a witness?
[right][snapback]9443[/snapback][/right]
[right][snapback]9443[/snapback][/right]
What would be yours ?
meekness
that's too easy....
come on guys, what criteria would determine the authenticity of a witness
and we are talking of the time frame prior to the beginning of the tribulation. let's say 1101 days before and let's arbitrarily set the date at 7/14/2008.
remember, we are being hypothetical. so keep it nice!
come on guys, what criteria would determine the authenticity of a witness
and we are talking of the time frame prior to the beginning of the tribulation. let's say 1101 days before and let's arbitrarily set the date at 7/14/2008.
remember, we are being hypothetical. so keep it nice!
a true witness does not testify about himself.
his testimony is in behalf of another.
for a witness is present to speak not about himself, but rather about the one being charged.
a witness provides testimony.
the testimony is about another.
the focus is upon the case at law.
-bz
his testimony is in behalf of another.
for a witness is present to speak not about himself, but rather about the one being charged.
a witness provides testimony.
the testimony is about another.
the focus is upon the case at law.
-bz
in order for testimony to be established, at least two witnesses are required by God's law.
the doer of the deed is not the witness. the witness testifies in behalf of another. He tells the things he has seen and heard.
the doer of the deed is not the witness. the witness testifies in behalf of another. He tells the things he has seen and heard.
a true witness tells the truth.
a false witness launches forth lies.
-the commandment from the Father is:
You must not bear false witness.
-bz
a false witness launches forth lies.
-the commandment from the Father is:
You must not bear false witness.
-bz
lie detector tests
body language....
....
past form ....
internal consistency
body language....
....
past form ....
internal consistency
nobody will agree on what defines the two witnesses. only them themselves know until that day when it begins. right?
hello enok.
what are your thoughts on this?
i have been watching for your reply.
please stay.
-bz
what are your thoughts on this?
i have been watching for your reply.
please stay.
-bz
The two witnesses of the LORD, have been instructed to hack off their hair and to put on sacks for clothes and to tie a rope around their waist for a belt, as a witness against the people.
When they begin their ministry, They are sent to, large congregations of people, who claim they are CHRIST'S people, Where they will be laughed at, mocked and treated spitefully. Then when the word is given by the church leaders, for them to be thrown out of the congregation, then fire will consume the young men, who try to lay hands on them, and great fear will fall on all who see it. Then the LORD'S two witnesses will speak to the sky and to the heavens, in front of these, two congregations, who have rejected them. Then lightning, thundering, and earthquakes will go out from these two different parts of the earth, over the face of the whole earth, And the two witnesses of the LORD will have given the order, that no more rain shall fall on the face of the earth, for three and a half years, or a time, times, and a half time, or one thousand two hundred and sixty days, or forty two months. Then all weather, over the face of the whole earth, will disappear, for that amount of time. Immediately the sun will cause blistering heat everywhere . It will become like a death valley summer everywhere on earth.
Although witness of these events will go out from the two congregations. Not every one on earth will know the truth about what has happened. Most people will be subject to the rumors and debates produced by the news medias and talk shows. Even the prominent scientists and leaders will give their opinions. But the truth will remain, That GOD, has begun to take away his daily sacrifice to man, and the great trouble, of which there has been none greater since there was a nation, no, nor will there be any greater, HAS BEGUN. This is also the beginning of the time period, for the setting up, of the abomination of desolation.
The two witnesses, will continue their ministry, only to be rejected by most Christian assemblies. Then not many days after the weather on earth disappears, and because the people, that call themselves, the people of GOD, will not receive correction from the LORD'S two witnesses, They will speak to the oceans and seas, in front of the congregations who have rejected them. Then going out from those two different parts of the earth, The oceans and seas, of the earth, will turn to blood. Like the blood of a dead man, and every living thing in the oceans and seas, will die.
The LORD'S two witnesses will continue their ministry, going out to more Christian congregations. Even though most of them will be in a panic by then. The two witnesses will still be mocked and treated shamefully. Then because those who speak in the name of the LORD, will not listen to the word of the LORD, through HIS two witnesses. They will speak to the inland waters, from two different parts of the earth, in front of two different congregations. Then the waters of the rivers, lakes, reservoirs, levies, canals, wells, springs, bottles, cans, and all fresh water supplies, will turn to blood, Like the blood of a dead man, And every living thing in the waters will die. Even the remainder of the polar ice caps that did not melt from the blistering heat, will turn to blood.
The slanderers of the earth will give all kinds of reasons and theories about why and what has happened. But all of their efforts to explain and to overcome, will come to nothing.
This plague of blood will change things here on earth, very rapidly. Electricity will stop, because of no water to turn their generators. Business will stop, because of no electricity. Darkness will fall on the seat of the beast, on every nation on earth. All manufacturing will stop, all over the globe. Not many days will pass, and people will abandon their homes. Because of the heat, and when they turn on their faucets and flush their toilets, blood will come out instead of water. And so after a while, EVERY HOUSE IS SHUT UP SO THAT NONE MAY GO IN.
At this point, The general public will be in a great panic.
There will be violent runs on super markets, gas stations, stores of all kinds. Finally every place that bought or sold or stored anything, will be looted and destroyed by the people. Fires will consume much, because there will be no water to put them out. Very quickly all of the supplies of everything in the world, will be gone.
Most of the people will become vicious, because of the heat and no food and water. Then those who love evil and despise GOOD will begin robbing, killing, raping, pillaging and hating each other, even their own brothers and sisters, over whatever they can find.
The LORD'S two witnesses will continue their ministry, Even though a congregation is hard to find by human standards, the SPIRIT of the LORD leads them on. Now many people have come to the knowledge of the truth. But there are many more who have not. So in front of congregations who have rejected them. They will speak the words, and great swarms of insects, both flying and crawling insects, will appear all over the earth. Then the insects will eat every remaining plant and tree. Because of the amount of meat eating and stinging insects, many people will die from this plague. Then the wild animals, even the pets that once befriended them, will turn on them in packs. The birds will start feeding on the dead bodies of people, That will start lining the streets of the cities of the world. Nuclear power plants will melt down and kill many, because of the suddenness of no water to cool them. Things will really start to escalate. Prisoners will walk out of the prisons, when they are abandoned by the people who can no longer feed and water them. The militaries and policing agencies, of the world, will disband, because they will be as worthless and vicious as everyone else, in the world.
And thus those who restrain, are taken out of the way, and the man of sin is now revealed. There will be a crying in the streets, on the hills, in the mountains and in the valleys for water, food, wine, drugs, cigarettes, medicines, all that anyone had grown fond of will be gone, And all that their souls long for they will not find. The blood in the oceans, seas, and inland water supplies will coagulate, harden and rot. The stink will go up into the air, and be hard to bare, along with the smell of rotting bodies everywhere.
All that man has created by worshiping the works of his hands, has come to nothing. All of the gold, silver, jewels, money, cars, trucks, fuels, talent, causes, knowledge, songs, ability, ministries, Nothing will be able to buy a single drop of water, to drink, or a single bite of food to eat, or a way out of the extreme heat of the days. So everyone is in the same condition, as with the rich so with the poor, as with the buyer so with the seller, as with the shepherd so with the sheep. All who have rejected the LORD and his two witnesses, are in agony.
Things will get so bad, Bands of people will form all over the world, That will start killing people and eating them for food and drinking their blood for water. They will be using, and trusting in, guns, knives, bows and arrows, cross bows, machine guns canons, airplanes, helicopters, tanks. All kinds of arms to do this thing. Now if anyone chooses this path of eating people for food and drinking blood for water. They will be sealed for destruction at the coming of the LORD. Regardless of whether it is distilled or any other deception. Those who have not found the truth by then, who would be called a child of LIGHT, will eat any other thing, Insects, animals, ect. Finally every animal will have been killed or eaten for food.
Those who have believed will be in the camps of the LORD. The LORD'S true shepherds will have started up camps where the SPIRIT of the LORD will feed the people with manna. The true shepherds will bring water out of the face of the rock to water the flocks. There will be nothing in the camps of the LORD except people. The people will be bald with their hair hacked off, it will be the same with men, women, and children. They will all be clothed in sack cloth, with a rope around their waist. Everyone will be dirty and smell like people who have not bathed in a long time. No one justified will wear any ornaments or paint on the bodies that are called the temple of GOD, because of the fear of the LORD. All of the people in the camps will give praise and thanks to the LORD day and night in fear and trembling. For the fear of the LORD had been taught by the commandments of men, teaching their god who loves perversity. But now they can see that man was wrong, and after all that has happened, The LORD has delivered them from it all. The SPIRIT of the LORD has fed and watered them and protected them with HIS fire that comes down from the sky on the heads of his enemies. The SPIRIT of the LORD is also their unseen shade from the heat of the days.
All of this will take place after the hirelings, who were in charge of the LORD'S sheep in THE GREEN WOOD, have come to nothing in the DRY. Those who divined for money and taught and prophesied for a bribe. For they could not show or tell their followers what to do to cure their ills. They were worthless because of what they believed. So some of them will become sheep needing help themselves, because of true humility. Others will try to flee the persecution of their own followers, only to find, there is no place to run. Some will be dashed to pieces, because they were treacherous dealers, Indeed they were very treacherous dealers.
Still the LORD had true shepherds out there, waiting for all of this to happen, and more sheep will be added to their flocks daily, even from the beginning of troubles. And the saying of the LORD is remembered, "WHO THEN IS A FAITHFULL AND WISE SERVANT, WHOM HIS MASTER MADE RULER OVER HIS HOUSEHOLD, TO GIVE THEM FOOD IN DUE SEASON? BLESSED IS THAT SERVANT WHOM HIS MASTER WHEN HE COMES, WILL FIND SO DOING".
The SPIRIT of the LORD will also send out to gather, the poor in spirit, the meek of the earth, the pure in heart, those who thirst after righteousness, and all who sit in sack cloth with bald heads and cry out to the LORD for comfort.
Now there will be a group of people, who will have been surviving on processed people for food, and processed blood for water, They are also a religious group. Their leaders will have stumbled onto some of the LORDS power, But by the LORD'S design. They will gain power over most of the existing world and they will have all of mans devices at their disposal. They will lie to themselves and to all who follow them. They will say that the true GOD of heaven is with them, They will show the power of GOD to prove it. They will cause many to become sacrifices for their stomach. Then when the time has been fulfilled, And when they have reestablished their T.V. transmissions, They will kill the LORD'S two witnesses, who will be together at that time, by the power of GOD. It is part of the two witnesses ministry to die.
Now the devils who will kill them, will further deceive themselves, because when the two witnesses die, the weather will return to the earth, just like it was before the two witnesses of the LORD came. Now because it has become a common thing, to let dead bodies lay where they die, over the past three and a half years, and because of fear. No one will bury the two witnesses, of the LORD. Their dead bodies will lay in the street where they are killed, for three and a half days.
The evil ones and everyone who has followed them, will be happy and full of joy, thinking that it is all over, That the two
devils who tormented those who live on the earth are dead. They will send gifts to one another and rejoice and party it up for days. They will work hard on trying to restore as much as
possible of the world, to the way it was before. For they are
lovers of the world, and this is where their hearts and minds are.
Then on the fourth day, half way through the fourth day, making it three and a half days, with their cameras in place, because of their arrogance, to disprove the rumors, The breath of life, from GOD, will inter back into the two witnesses, and they will stand up on their feet. Then a loud voice from the sky will say "COME UP HERE". Then the two witnesses, will ascend up into the sky, and go out of sight into a cloud. Great fear will fall on all who see and hear this.
When they begin their ministry, They are sent to, large congregations of people, who claim they are CHRIST'S people, Where they will be laughed at, mocked and treated spitefully. Then when the word is given by the church leaders, for them to be thrown out of the congregation, then fire will consume the young men, who try to lay hands on them, and great fear will fall on all who see it. Then the LORD'S two witnesses will speak to the sky and to the heavens, in front of these, two congregations, who have rejected them. Then lightning, thundering, and earthquakes will go out from these two different parts of the earth, over the face of the whole earth, And the two witnesses of the LORD will have given the order, that no more rain shall fall on the face of the earth, for three and a half years, or a time, times, and a half time, or one thousand two hundred and sixty days, or forty two months. Then all weather, over the face of the whole earth, will disappear, for that amount of time. Immediately the sun will cause blistering heat everywhere . It will become like a death valley summer everywhere on earth.
Although witness of these events will go out from the two congregations. Not every one on earth will know the truth about what has happened. Most people will be subject to the rumors and debates produced by the news medias and talk shows. Even the prominent scientists and leaders will give their opinions. But the truth will remain, That GOD, has begun to take away his daily sacrifice to man, and the great trouble, of which there has been none greater since there was a nation, no, nor will there be any greater, HAS BEGUN. This is also the beginning of the time period, for the setting up, of the abomination of desolation.
The two witnesses, will continue their ministry, only to be rejected by most Christian assemblies. Then not many days after the weather on earth disappears, and because the people, that call themselves, the people of GOD, will not receive correction from the LORD'S two witnesses, They will speak to the oceans and seas, in front of the congregations who have rejected them. Then going out from those two different parts of the earth, The oceans and seas, of the earth, will turn to blood. Like the blood of a dead man, and every living thing in the oceans and seas, will die.
The LORD'S two witnesses will continue their ministry, going out to more Christian congregations. Even though most of them will be in a panic by then. The two witnesses will still be mocked and treated shamefully. Then because those who speak in the name of the LORD, will not listen to the word of the LORD, through HIS two witnesses. They will speak to the inland waters, from two different parts of the earth, in front of two different congregations. Then the waters of the rivers, lakes, reservoirs, levies, canals, wells, springs, bottles, cans, and all fresh water supplies, will turn to blood, Like the blood of a dead man, And every living thing in the waters will die. Even the remainder of the polar ice caps that did not melt from the blistering heat, will turn to blood.
The slanderers of the earth will give all kinds of reasons and theories about why and what has happened. But all of their efforts to explain and to overcome, will come to nothing.
This plague of blood will change things here on earth, very rapidly. Electricity will stop, because of no water to turn their generators. Business will stop, because of no electricity. Darkness will fall on the seat of the beast, on every nation on earth. All manufacturing will stop, all over the globe. Not many days will pass, and people will abandon their homes. Because of the heat, and when they turn on their faucets and flush their toilets, blood will come out instead of water. And so after a while, EVERY HOUSE IS SHUT UP SO THAT NONE MAY GO IN.
At this point, The general public will be in a great panic.
There will be violent runs on super markets, gas stations, stores of all kinds. Finally every place that bought or sold or stored anything, will be looted and destroyed by the people. Fires will consume much, because there will be no water to put them out. Very quickly all of the supplies of everything in the world, will be gone.
Most of the people will become vicious, because of the heat and no food and water. Then those who love evil and despise GOOD will begin robbing, killing, raping, pillaging and hating each other, even their own brothers and sisters, over whatever they can find.
The LORD'S two witnesses will continue their ministry, Even though a congregation is hard to find by human standards, the SPIRIT of the LORD leads them on. Now many people have come to the knowledge of the truth. But there are many more who have not. So in front of congregations who have rejected them. They will speak the words, and great swarms of insects, both flying and crawling insects, will appear all over the earth. Then the insects will eat every remaining plant and tree. Because of the amount of meat eating and stinging insects, many people will die from this plague. Then the wild animals, even the pets that once befriended them, will turn on them in packs. The birds will start feeding on the dead bodies of people, That will start lining the streets of the cities of the world. Nuclear power plants will melt down and kill many, because of the suddenness of no water to cool them. Things will really start to escalate. Prisoners will walk out of the prisons, when they are abandoned by the people who can no longer feed and water them. The militaries and policing agencies, of the world, will disband, because they will be as worthless and vicious as everyone else, in the world.
And thus those who restrain, are taken out of the way, and the man of sin is now revealed. There will be a crying in the streets, on the hills, in the mountains and in the valleys for water, food, wine, drugs, cigarettes, medicines, all that anyone had grown fond of will be gone, And all that their souls long for they will not find. The blood in the oceans, seas, and inland water supplies will coagulate, harden and rot. The stink will go up into the air, and be hard to bare, along with the smell of rotting bodies everywhere.
All that man has created by worshiping the works of his hands, has come to nothing. All of the gold, silver, jewels, money, cars, trucks, fuels, talent, causes, knowledge, songs, ability, ministries, Nothing will be able to buy a single drop of water, to drink, or a single bite of food to eat, or a way out of the extreme heat of the days. So everyone is in the same condition, as with the rich so with the poor, as with the buyer so with the seller, as with the shepherd so with the sheep. All who have rejected the LORD and his two witnesses, are in agony.
Things will get so bad, Bands of people will form all over the world, That will start killing people and eating them for food and drinking their blood for water. They will be using, and trusting in, guns, knives, bows and arrows, cross bows, machine guns canons, airplanes, helicopters, tanks. All kinds of arms to do this thing. Now if anyone chooses this path of eating people for food and drinking blood for water. They will be sealed for destruction at the coming of the LORD. Regardless of whether it is distilled or any other deception. Those who have not found the truth by then, who would be called a child of LIGHT, will eat any other thing, Insects, animals, ect. Finally every animal will have been killed or eaten for food.
Those who have believed will be in the camps of the LORD. The LORD'S true shepherds will have started up camps where the SPIRIT of the LORD will feed the people with manna. The true shepherds will bring water out of the face of the rock to water the flocks. There will be nothing in the camps of the LORD except people. The people will be bald with their hair hacked off, it will be the same with men, women, and children. They will all be clothed in sack cloth, with a rope around their waist. Everyone will be dirty and smell like people who have not bathed in a long time. No one justified will wear any ornaments or paint on the bodies that are called the temple of GOD, because of the fear of the LORD. All of the people in the camps will give praise and thanks to the LORD day and night in fear and trembling. For the fear of the LORD had been taught by the commandments of men, teaching their god who loves perversity. But now they can see that man was wrong, and after all that has happened, The LORD has delivered them from it all. The SPIRIT of the LORD has fed and watered them and protected them with HIS fire that comes down from the sky on the heads of his enemies. The SPIRIT of the LORD is also their unseen shade from the heat of the days.
All of this will take place after the hirelings, who were in charge of the LORD'S sheep in THE GREEN WOOD, have come to nothing in the DRY. Those who divined for money and taught and prophesied for a bribe. For they could not show or tell their followers what to do to cure their ills. They were worthless because of what they believed. So some of them will become sheep needing help themselves, because of true humility. Others will try to flee the persecution of their own followers, only to find, there is no place to run. Some will be dashed to pieces, because they were treacherous dealers, Indeed they were very treacherous dealers.
Still the LORD had true shepherds out there, waiting for all of this to happen, and more sheep will be added to their flocks daily, even from the beginning of troubles. And the saying of the LORD is remembered, "WHO THEN IS A FAITHFULL AND WISE SERVANT, WHOM HIS MASTER MADE RULER OVER HIS HOUSEHOLD, TO GIVE THEM FOOD IN DUE SEASON? BLESSED IS THAT SERVANT WHOM HIS MASTER WHEN HE COMES, WILL FIND SO DOING".
The SPIRIT of the LORD will also send out to gather, the poor in spirit, the meek of the earth, the pure in heart, those who thirst after righteousness, and all who sit in sack cloth with bald heads and cry out to the LORD for comfort.
Now there will be a group of people, who will have been surviving on processed people for food, and processed blood for water, They are also a religious group. Their leaders will have stumbled onto some of the LORDS power, But by the LORD'S design. They will gain power over most of the existing world and they will have all of mans devices at their disposal. They will lie to themselves and to all who follow them. They will say that the true GOD of heaven is with them, They will show the power of GOD to prove it. They will cause many to become sacrifices for their stomach. Then when the time has been fulfilled, And when they have reestablished their T.V. transmissions, They will kill the LORD'S two witnesses, who will be together at that time, by the power of GOD. It is part of the two witnesses ministry to die.
Now the devils who will kill them, will further deceive themselves, because when the two witnesses die, the weather will return to the earth, just like it was before the two witnesses of the LORD came. Now because it has become a common thing, to let dead bodies lay where they die, over the past three and a half years, and because of fear. No one will bury the two witnesses, of the LORD. Their dead bodies will lay in the street where they are killed, for three and a half days.
The evil ones and everyone who has followed them, will be happy and full of joy, thinking that it is all over, That the two
devils who tormented those who live on the earth are dead. They will send gifts to one another and rejoice and party it up for days. They will work hard on trying to restore as much as
possible of the world, to the way it was before. For they are
lovers of the world, and this is where their hearts and minds are.
Then on the fourth day, half way through the fourth day, making it three and a half days, with their cameras in place, because of their arrogance, to disprove the rumors, The breath of life, from GOD, will inter back into the two witnesses, and they will stand up on their feet. Then a loud voice from the sky will say "COME UP HERE". Then the two witnesses, will ascend up into the sky, and go out of sight into a cloud. Great fear will fall on all who see and hear this.
Gosh Godssolidier...you painted a vivid picture... 
Thats not my writing I just cut and pasted it.
Rember Elijah ( Charles Martin)
That is his. I have been l checking into what he said will happen. I believe it to be true. The more I study the more I see it in scripture.
But that is just my opinion.
Rember Elijah ( Charles Martin)
That is his. I have been l checking into what he said will happen. I believe it to be true. The more I study the more I see it in scripture.
But that is just my opinion.
Here is a link to the full prophecy. That was only part of it.
http://www.faithfulboards.com/index.php?showtopic=7
http://www.faithfulboards.com/index.php?showtopic=7
QUOTE(Godssoldier @ Jul 27 2005, 04:23 PM)
Here is a link to the full prophecy. That was only part of it.
http://www.faithfulboards.com/index.php?showtopic=7
[right][snapback]10364[/snapback][/right]
http://www.faithfulboards.com/index.php?showtopic=7
[right][snapback]10364[/snapback][/right]
Wow Godsoldier, that was very eye-opening...a lot more grim than I had imagined it; but of course those will not be wonderful times at all! That was about how I see it happening. Thank you for posting that.
what do you think? what does this mean?
"fire comes out of the mouths" of the two witnesses. -Rev 11:5
it devours their enemies, and if anyone wants to harm them, in this manner, they must be killed.
are they dragons? (LOL) --in the end, they are slain.
but, they, like their lord, rise again.
what is the "fire out of their mouths", do you think?
in what way does it "consume those that would hurt them"?
do they ever make "fire come down out of heaven"?
who does that?
just food for thougth.
and you can be sure....these 2 are not of the "popular, well-admired, aldulated among men," sort....
their "dress" is an indication of their situation....they are in repentance themselves. for that is the meaning of 'sackcloth'...'mourning' ....they are greived.
no doubt, for the whole world.
(think in spiritual terms.)
but, what do you think the meaning of "fire out of their mouths" is?
(the answer is found in God's word.)
what scriptures can you find?
-bz
"fire comes out of the mouths" of the two witnesses. -Rev 11:5
it devours their enemies, and if anyone wants to harm them, in this manner, they must be killed.
are they dragons? (LOL) --in the end, they are slain.
but, they, like their lord, rise again.
what is the "fire out of their mouths", do you think?
in what way does it "consume those that would hurt them"?
do they ever make "fire come down out of heaven"?
who does that?
just food for thougth.
and you can be sure....these 2 are not of the "popular, well-admired, aldulated among men," sort....
their "dress" is an indication of their situation....they are in repentance themselves. for that is the meaning of 'sackcloth'...'mourning' ....they are greived.
no doubt, for the whole world.
(think in spiritual terms.)
but, what do you think the meaning of "fire out of their mouths" is?
(the answer is found in God's word.)
what scriptures can you find?
-bz
Revelation 11:5
Find out what it means here
http://bible.crosswalk.com/OnlineStudyBibl...r&new=1&oq=fire
Find out what it means here
http://bible.crosswalk.com/OnlineStudyBibl...r&new=1&oq=fire
Strong's Number: 4442 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
pu'r a root word
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Pur 6:928,975
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
poor Noun Neuter
Definition
fire
King James Word Usage - Total: 74
fire 73, fiery 1
Strong's Number: 1607 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
ejkporeuvomai from (1537) and (4198)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Ekporeuomai 6:578,915
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
ek-por-yoo'-om-ahee Verb
Definition
to go forth, go out, depart
metaph.
to come forth, to issue, to proceed
of feelings, affections, deeds, sayings
to flow forth
of a river
to project, from the mouth of one
to spread abroad, of a rumour
Strong's Number: 2719 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
katesqivw from (2596) and (2068) (including its alternate)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Katesthio None
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
kat-es-thee'-o Verb
Definition
to consume by eating, to eat up, devour
of birds
of a dragon
of a man eating up the little book
metaph.
to devour i.e. squander, waste: substance
to devour i.e. forcibly appropriate: widows' property
to strip one of his goods
to ruin (by the infliction of injuries)
by fire, to devour i.e. to utterly consume, destroy
of the consumption of the strength of body and mind by strong emotions
So i think it is safe to say that the verse is literal and not a metaphore for anything.
Original Word Word Origin
pu'r a root word
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Pur 6:928,975
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
poor Noun Neuter
Definition
fire
King James Word Usage - Total: 74
fire 73, fiery 1
Strong's Number: 1607 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
ejkporeuvomai from (1537) and (4198)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Ekporeuomai 6:578,915
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
ek-por-yoo'-om-ahee Verb
Definition
to go forth, go out, depart
metaph.
to come forth, to issue, to proceed
of feelings, affections, deeds, sayings
to flow forth
of a river
to project, from the mouth of one
to spread abroad, of a rumour
Strong's Number: 2719 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
katesqivw from (2596) and (2068) (including its alternate)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Katesthio None
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
kat-es-thee'-o Verb
Definition
to consume by eating, to eat up, devour
of birds
of a dragon
of a man eating up the little book
metaph.
to devour i.e. squander, waste: substance
to devour i.e. forcibly appropriate: widows' property
to strip one of his goods
to ruin (by the infliction of injuries)
by fire, to devour i.e. to utterly consume, destroy
of the consumption of the strength of body and mind by strong emotions
So i think it is safe to say that the verse is literal and not a metaphore for anything.
you would do well to consider Jeremiah 24:29, for starters.
and yes, the fire comes out, because the "little book" is consumed. (see reference post above...it mentions dragons too.)
out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
and i tell you that it burns like a fire ....like fire shut up in the bones!
the one who "ate a little scroll"...there is a mentioning of it twice in scripture...sweet in the mouth to the taste, while consuming it....but in the belly it becomes BITTER.
bz
and yes, the fire comes out, because the "little book" is consumed. (see reference post above...it mentions dragons too.)
out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
and i tell you that it burns like a fire ....like fire shut up in the bones!
the one who "ate a little scroll"...there is a mentioning of it twice in scripture...sweet in the mouth to the taste, while consuming it....but in the belly it becomes BITTER.
bz
if you think it literal? then you best look for a smoker.
my error....
corrected reference, is Jeremiah 23:29.
(losing my vision in my old age.)
i am blindzebra (fitting, eh?)
corrected reference, is Jeremiah 23:29.
(losing my vision in my old age.)
i am blindzebra (fitting, eh?)
bz Why do you play games?
Why are you never forward with your beliefs? You are secretive like youknow something we dont.
Ezekiel 33:6
But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the trumpet, and the people be not warned; if the sword come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.
Why do you ask alot of questions and not give any answers?
Do you really know the interpretation or are you just out to be a stumbling block?
Do we really need to interpret something different when the scripture is as plain as day?
Why didnt you know that the scripture I quoted yesturday was talking about the Kingdom of God? His chosen
Why havent you regestered as a member yet?
I think I know where you are going with with the scroll, but not to sure.
Ill get back to you later.
Why are you never forward with your beliefs? You are secretive like youknow something we dont.
Ezekiel 33:6
But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the trumpet, and the people be not warned; if the sword come, and take any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.
Why do you ask alot of questions and not give any answers?
Do you really know the interpretation or are you just out to be a stumbling block?
Do we really need to interpret something different when the scripture is as plain as day?
Why didnt you know that the scripture I quoted yesturday was talking about the Kingdom of God? His chosen
Why havent you regestered as a member yet?
I think I know where you are going with with the scroll, but not to sure.
Ill get back to you later.
dear godssoldier,
please forgive me if i sound a certain way....if i offend.
it is not my intention to hurt you, or to hurt anyone. or to seem as if i am playing.
i am not playing a game. there are answers to each of the questions.
sigh...(how do you express an exhalation of air? with a certain sadness?)
i just took a long bath....and thought of you.
and when out, i prayed, and you were in my prayer.
i do seek peace with you. and with all.
gs, there is so much we share in common.
we are are all struggling together and working to come to know more,
and to seek the True God. to seek the accurate knowledge of Him.
it is the thing. --(please see John 17:3) it is our Father's will that we seek the knowledge of him. i am seeking those who wish to seek with me.
and so many i see right here! my heart is tender for you and for the many here....so precious.
please, i am sorry if i hurt you.
but i do have a few insights...these are not mine, and do not originate wit me, but were given me.
true insight-- always, it comes from our Father. he is the giver.
what i know is little, and it is gradual. but a little can mean alot to many, and it does to me.
and i just wish to share the few insights i have sought and gained.
they are not in any way complete. and the unfolding is gradual.
i too am looking for the finishing of the mystery and
have little to offer, but strong conviction of some things.
uncertainly of others.....on the edge of discovery...and there is yet always more and more.
clues.
and when they come, they frighten even me.
and i am doing my best to share what i have, with imperfect ability.
But our Father accomplishes his will....and he uses whomever he will....and quite typically, those whom are considered as the off-scouring among men. even "prostitutes, and tax-collectors"...nobody "grand" or noble. His son is the perfect example of the surprise 'nobody'.
even the two witnesses do not choose themselves, but are chosen by God to accomplish his will....the power they will recieve is because he gives them power. it is by the power of his spirit that they bear witness. it is not of their own power.
these bear witness to the truth. they do not bear witness to themselves, but seek to witness concerning the Father and the warning of the Day of Judgement. They seek to honor their father, as the son sought honor for his Father.
what i have to offer is 'food for thought'. God's spirit, working with each individual does the rest... i want to motivate ones to seek the scriptures, to find the answers.. i too do this.
i do not like to say...this is how it is!
but rather, to help others to see it their own process of discovery.
i have questions i ask God --all the time! and be assured i do not "know it all" LOL what a laugh to think that! that IS a joke!
but perhaps in the spirit of mildness and respect we can be more clear, and work together to come to understanding one another, and to work toward a more perfect understanding. ...toghether.
questions are a way of initiating a converstational exhange, for the mutual upbuilding of both parties.
let us do so together with highest regard and deep respect for the other. you have feelings and a heart. i do too.. and all those who listen do as well. they are to be considered as important too. even more so.
so perhaps we could even return to our last topic of exchange and seek to know where the other is coming from ....for there must be a basis for our thoughts and beliefs....if we do not understand where one is basing a belief, how will we know how to proceed to understand...
and then....let us ask questions....and expect that we too will be asked questions is return.
i like you do, hold God's as the highest authority for belief that something is true, or not.
so, i would welcome a warm and considerate interchange of thought about yesterdays topic, and of course, the two witness topic is always of great interest to any who have read the Revelation to John.
shall we begin anew? :smileyface?:
with love, and compassion,
blindzebra
please forgive me if i sound a certain way....if i offend.
it is not my intention to hurt you, or to hurt anyone. or to seem as if i am playing.
i am not playing a game. there are answers to each of the questions.
sigh...(how do you express an exhalation of air? with a certain sadness?)
i just took a long bath....and thought of you.
and when out, i prayed, and you were in my prayer.
i do seek peace with you. and with all.
gs, there is so much we share in common.
we are are all struggling together and working to come to know more,
and to seek the True God. to seek the accurate knowledge of Him.
it is the thing. --(please see John 17:3) it is our Father's will that we seek the knowledge of him. i am seeking those who wish to seek with me.
and so many i see right here! my heart is tender for you and for the many here....so precious.
please, i am sorry if i hurt you.
but i do have a few insights...these are not mine, and do not originate wit me, but were given me.
true insight-- always, it comes from our Father. he is the giver.
what i know is little, and it is gradual. but a little can mean alot to many, and it does to me.
and i just wish to share the few insights i have sought and gained.
they are not in any way complete. and the unfolding is gradual.
i too am looking for the finishing of the mystery and
have little to offer, but strong conviction of some things.
uncertainly of others.....on the edge of discovery...and there is yet always more and more.
clues.
and when they come, they frighten even me.
and i am doing my best to share what i have, with imperfect ability.
But our Father accomplishes his will....and he uses whomever he will....and quite typically, those whom are considered as the off-scouring among men. even "prostitutes, and tax-collectors"...nobody "grand" or noble. His son is the perfect example of the surprise 'nobody'.
even the two witnesses do not choose themselves, but are chosen by God to accomplish his will....the power they will recieve is because he gives them power. it is by the power of his spirit that they bear witness. it is not of their own power.
these bear witness to the truth. they do not bear witness to themselves, but seek to witness concerning the Father and the warning of the Day of Judgement. They seek to honor their father, as the son sought honor for his Father.
what i have to offer is 'food for thought'. God's spirit, working with each individual does the rest... i want to motivate ones to seek the scriptures, to find the answers.. i too do this.
i do not like to say...this is how it is!
but rather, to help others to see it their own process of discovery.
i have questions i ask God --all the time! and be assured i do not "know it all" LOL what a laugh to think that! that IS a joke!
but perhaps in the spirit of mildness and respect we can be more clear, and work together to come to understanding one another, and to work toward a more perfect understanding. ...toghether.
questions are a way of initiating a converstational exhange, for the mutual upbuilding of both parties.
let us do so together with highest regard and deep respect for the other. you have feelings and a heart. i do too.. and all those who listen do as well. they are to be considered as important too. even more so.
so perhaps we could even return to our last topic of exchange and seek to know where the other is coming from ....for there must be a basis for our thoughts and beliefs....if we do not understand where one is basing a belief, how will we know how to proceed to understand...
and then....let us ask questions....and expect that we too will be asked questions is return.
i like you do, hold God's as the highest authority for belief that something is true, or not.
so, i would welcome a warm and considerate interchange of thought about yesterdays topic, and of course, the two witness topic is always of great interest to any who have read the Revelation to John.
shall we begin anew? :smileyface?:
with love, and compassion,
blindzebra
Sounds good to me. Sorry, I have been getting carried away alot recently.
I believe in a very literal interpretation of the bible. Untill you get into the prophecy books then you need to interpret. But even then some is explained that is easy to understand.
By literal I mean
Genesis 2
7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
So the dust of the ground combined with the breath of life from God constitutes a living soul. Remove any one of the two after they have been put together and you have a dead non existing soul. Unless of course that soul is written in Gods hand. Then you will for sure come back to life.
As far as my understanding of the little book is concerned.
Ecc 1:18
For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow.
There is nothing sweeter to me than to serve God but the closer I get the more God shows me the more my heart becomes heavy because I know what is to come. What understanding God has given me becomes bitter. But I push on because it is not about me it is about serving God. The purpose He has chosen me for. Obedience to Him.
http://www.christian-forum.net/index.php?showtopic=844
There is a link to my testimony if you have not seen it.
Anyother questions feel free to ask.
I believe in a very literal interpretation of the bible. Untill you get into the prophecy books then you need to interpret. But even then some is explained that is easy to understand.
By literal I mean
Genesis 2
7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
So the dust of the ground combined with the breath of life from God constitutes a living soul. Remove any one of the two after they have been put together and you have a dead non existing soul. Unless of course that soul is written in Gods hand. Then you will for sure come back to life.
As far as my understanding of the little book is concerned.
Ecc 1:18
For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow.
There is nothing sweeter to me than to serve God but the closer I get the more God shows me the more my heart becomes heavy because I know what is to come. What understanding God has given me becomes bitter. But I push on because it is not about me it is about serving God. The purpose He has chosen me for. Obedience to Him.
http://www.christian-forum.net/index.php?showtopic=844
There is a link to my testimony if you have not seen it.
Anyother questions feel free to ask.
hey gs, guess what? i am in complete agreement with you as to what is taught in scripture about "soul"....a Soul is not some shadowy thing...
it is a living creature, that breathes, made of the elements, that breathes, and has life.
(even fish in the sea, are called "souls" in scripture.)
old sayings:
old king cole was a merry old soul....(not had a soul)
that poor poor soul....(meaning that poor person)
so we find agreement! how about that?
as for your reference to Ecclesiastes.....it is true also. very much so.
only ignorance is bliss....another true saying.
so. okay. i have not read your testimony yet....i will.
God's word can be understood with many folds, or layers of understanding. and the scroll is written upon on front, and on the reverse!
the first shall be last, and the last shall be first. this statement in itself indicates a reversal or order...
"manifold" wisdom. (and there are at least three dimensions that make up even our physical world!)
to me, it is scary scary scary.
but wonderful beyond descritption!
the word of God is sharp sharp sharp.
boy do we have a lot to learn, or what?
LOL
love,
bz
it is a living creature, that breathes, made of the elements, that breathes, and has life.
(even fish in the sea, are called "souls" in scripture.)
old sayings:
old king cole was a merry old soul....(not had a soul)
that poor poor soul....(meaning that poor person)
so we find agreement! how about that?
as for your reference to Ecclesiastes.....it is true also. very much so.
only ignorance is bliss....another true saying.
so. okay. i have not read your testimony yet....i will.
God's word can be understood with many folds, or layers of understanding. and the scroll is written upon on front, and on the reverse!
the first shall be last, and the last shall be first. this statement in itself indicates a reversal or order...
"manifold" wisdom. (and there are at least three dimensions that make up even our physical world!)
to me, it is scary scary scary.
but wonderful beyond descritption!
the word of God is sharp sharp sharp.
boy do we have a lot to learn, or what?
LOL
love,
bz
QUOTE(Guest @ Jul 10 2005, 10:27 AM)
in order for testimony to be established, at least two witnesses are required by God's law.
the doer of the deed is not the witness. the witness testifies in behalf of another. He tells the things he has seen and heard.
[right][snapback]9550[/snapback][/right]
the doer of the deed is not the witness. the witness testifies in behalf of another. He tells the things he has seen and heard.
[right][snapback]9550[/snapback][/right]
Joh 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true. Joh 5:32 There is another that beareth witness of me; and I know that the witness which he witnesseth of me is true. Joh 5:33 Ye sent unto John, and he bare witness unto the truth. Joh 5:34 But I receive not testimony from man: but these things I say, that ye might be saved.
Gotta be something to think about when even Jesus said this (highlighted)
Enok, here's the answer you seek.
This is truth. The two witnesses revealed for those to hear with eyes to see.
Here is the rationale of the Atonement doctrine; the two halves, spirit and matter, god and man, must return to antecedent oneness. We are sent to bathe in the Pool of Siloam so that the two halves of our nature may be made into the original whole. Earthly human wedlock is but an emblem of the greater marriage of the two elements of matter and consciousness in one organism. In the light of which we venture to suggest an entirely new and undreamed-of meaning in Jesus’ statement that man, to be regenerate, must become as a little child. The child is of neither sex, functionally; and the man returned to deity is of neither sex. The redeemed must return to the sexless state of the child. Orthodox ignorance has read into Jesus’ utterance only a return to "the simple faith and purity of childhood." But there is in this no lift to the plane of cosmic and racial significance where alone the esoteric interpretations of ancient books is to be made. The Gospels are not dealing with everyday homiletics. They expound the occult laws of evolution. Jesus was telling the race that it must return to angelic epicene state, spiritually. We must reunite the two divided sexes in us. Paul endorses the necessity when he says that the wall of partition between us must be broken down, and the two made one new creature. And the Gnostic Jesus tells Salome that his kingdom will come when there shall be neither male nor female, but when both shall be one. Paul again supports the thesis when he says: "There is neither Jew nor Gentile, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female, for ye are all one in Christ Jesus," the biune being, the Alpha and Omega of any cycle. And no one can forget that impressive assurance of the Master himself that "when they shall arise from the dead they neither marry nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven" (Mark 12:25). Sex is an appurtenance of the body only. This is the meaning of the statement in Revelation that "the dragon shall rise up and slay" the two witnesses, the two thieves between whose opposite tensions the Christ had been crucified. Unification slays duality.
There you have it folks, the truth. Let those with ears to hear, hear.
This is truth. The two witnesses revealed for those to hear with eyes to see.
Here is the rationale of the Atonement doctrine; the two halves, spirit and matter, god and man, must return to antecedent oneness. We are sent to bathe in the Pool of Siloam so that the two halves of our nature may be made into the original whole. Earthly human wedlock is but an emblem of the greater marriage of the two elements of matter and consciousness in one organism. In the light of which we venture to suggest an entirely new and undreamed-of meaning in Jesus’ statement that man, to be regenerate, must become as a little child. The child is of neither sex, functionally; and the man returned to deity is of neither sex. The redeemed must return to the sexless state of the child. Orthodox ignorance has read into Jesus’ utterance only a return to "the simple faith and purity of childhood." But there is in this no lift to the plane of cosmic and racial significance where alone the esoteric interpretations of ancient books is to be made. The Gospels are not dealing with everyday homiletics. They expound the occult laws of evolution. Jesus was telling the race that it must return to angelic epicene state, spiritually. We must reunite the two divided sexes in us. Paul endorses the necessity when he says that the wall of partition between us must be broken down, and the two made one new creature. And the Gnostic Jesus tells Salome that his kingdom will come when there shall be neither male nor female, but when both shall be one. Paul again supports the thesis when he says: "There is neither Jew nor Gentile, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female, for ye are all one in Christ Jesus," the biune being, the Alpha and Omega of any cycle. And no one can forget that impressive assurance of the Master himself that "when they shall arise from the dead they neither marry nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven" (Mark 12:25). Sex is an appurtenance of the body only. This is the meaning of the statement in Revelation that "the dragon shall rise up and slay" the two witnesses, the two thieves between whose opposite tensions the Christ had been crucified. Unification slays duality.
There you have it folks, the truth. Let those with ears to hear, hear.
I'm slipping up here a little in your statements so please clarify something for me.
I've never felt darkness and light co equal as in yin yang....Is this what you're saying here?
Jesus Kingdom has come once we invite him in. He teaches us through the sanctification process and obediance lessons how to surrender to his fullness. His fullness is neither male nor female.
"Earthly human wedlock is but an emblem of the greater marriage of the two elements of matter and consciousness in one organism".
Ok...which one's the matter and which one's the consciousness?
In order for this to hold together the women would half to be matter
.
I think the man would be matter....
I'm not poking at you...well maybe a little....
You've got some interesting ideas. Keep um coming.
I'm not a metaphyisics expert but when you say; "But there is in this no lift to the plane of cosmic and racial significance where alone the esoteric interpretations of ancient books is to be made".
Esoteric interpretations can be taught and have been taught for centuries? So l'm not sure what you are formulating here. Esoteric interpretations are available to everybody once they are made aware of them.
I don't believe unification slays duality because light eliminates darkness, it doesn't absorb it. No matter which way you look at it darkness and light aren't co equal. Satans is a blip on the screen of God's handiwork. He's cast into the bottomless pit (maybe a black hole but he isn't absorbed into the Creator to become one. Yin Yang has no basis in Christianity. It just doesn't add up. 
I've never felt darkness and light co equal as in yin yang....Is this what you're saying here?
Jesus Kingdom has come once we invite him in. He teaches us through the sanctification process and obediance lessons how to surrender to his fullness. His fullness is neither male nor female.
"Earthly human wedlock is but an emblem of the greater marriage of the two elements of matter and consciousness in one organism".
Ok...which one's the matter and which one's the consciousness? In order for this to hold together the women would half to be matter
.I think the man would be matter....
I'm not poking at you...well maybe a little....
You've got some interesting ideas. Keep um coming.
I'm not a metaphyisics expert but when you say; "But there is in this no lift to the plane of cosmic and racial significance where alone the esoteric interpretations of ancient books is to be made".
Esoteric interpretations can be taught and have been taught for centuries? So l'm not sure what you are formulating here. Esoteric interpretations are available to everybody once they are made aware of them.
I don't believe unification slays duality because light eliminates darkness, it doesn't absorb it. No matter which way you look at it darkness and light aren't co equal. Satans is a blip on the screen of God's handiwork. He's cast into the bottomless pit (maybe a black hole
but he isn't absorbed into the Creator to become one. Yin Yang has no basis in Christianity. It just doesn't add up.
Miki,
I'll try hard to answer your questions and clarify the statements for you but I sense your curiosity is positive but your poking nature is negative even if it is just a little. Jesus teaches us to love one another and so we must do as he commands us. For only through him is all revealed.
I've never felt darkness and light co equal as in yin yang....Is this what you're saying here?
Absoultely Not, that is not at all what is said, you have missed the whole point but do not be dismayed. Darkness and Light are opposites and are not co equal. No where is darkness mentioned in my post.
"Earthly human wedlock is but an emblem of the greater marriage of the two elements of matter and consciousness in one organism". Ok...which one's the matter and which one's the consciousness?
Matter is a symbolic of our human nature also considered the "female" or tail, consciousness is symbolic of spirit or Father or head.
"But there is in this no lift to the plane of cosmic and racial significance where alone the esoteric interpretations of ancient books is to be made".
The choice of these words were made to explain a significance but it is difficult to understand for some. It simply means: It takes more than interpetations to truely understand the meaning of something. In other words, many can read the bible at the surface level and get some meaning but as Jesus said he spoke in parables to prevent the "dogs" from understanding.
I don't believe unification slays duality because light eliminates darkness, it doesn't absorb it. No matter which way you look at it darkness and light aren't co equal. Satans is a blip on the screen of God's handiwork. He's cast into the bottomless pit (maybe a black hole but he isn't absorbed into the Creator to become one. Yin Yang has no basis in Christianity. It just doesn't add up.
Again no where in the post is darkness or Ying and Yang mentioned.
This is what is meant by the statement "unification slays duality". In order words; the two halves, spirit and matter, must return to antecedent oneness. (antecedent meaning: One that precedes another)
Bible references which support the statement:
Paul again supports the thesis when he says: "There is neither Jew nor Gentile, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male(spirit) nor female(matter), for ye are all one(unification) in Christ Jesus."
And no one can forget that impressive assurance of the Master himself(Jesus) that "when they shall arise from the dead(unconsciousness) they neither marry(spirit) nor are given in marriage(matter); but are as the angels(unified) which are in heaven" (Mark 12:25).
You said the same meaning in your very own statement, you proved my point. I inserted words in () to illustrate.
"He(Jesus) teaches us through the sanctification process and obediance lessons how to surrender to his fullness(unification). His fullness is neither male(spirit) nor female(matter).
Miki, it is good to ask questions as you learn more when you do. You are young in spirit but keep seeking and you find what you are looking for.
Love fully,
David
I'll try hard to answer your questions and clarify the statements for you but I sense your curiosity is positive but your poking nature is negative even if it is just a little. Jesus teaches us to love one another and so we must do as he commands us. For only through him is all revealed.
I've never felt darkness and light co equal as in yin yang....Is this what you're saying here?
Absoultely Not, that is not at all what is said, you have missed the whole point but do not be dismayed. Darkness and Light are opposites and are not co equal. No where is darkness mentioned in my post.
"Earthly human wedlock is but an emblem of the greater marriage of the two elements of matter and consciousness in one organism". Ok...which one's the matter and which one's the consciousness?
Matter is a symbolic of our human nature also considered the "female" or tail, consciousness is symbolic of spirit or Father or head.
"But there is in this no lift to the plane of cosmic and racial significance where alone the esoteric interpretations of ancient books is to be made".
The choice of these words were made to explain a significance but it is difficult to understand for some. It simply means: It takes more than interpetations to truely understand the meaning of something. In other words, many can read the bible at the surface level and get some meaning but as Jesus said he spoke in parables to prevent the "dogs" from understanding.
I don't believe unification slays duality because light eliminates darkness, it doesn't absorb it. No matter which way you look at it darkness and light aren't co equal. Satans is a blip on the screen of God's handiwork. He's cast into the bottomless pit (maybe a black hole but he isn't absorbed into the Creator to become one. Yin Yang has no basis in Christianity. It just doesn't add up.
Again no where in the post is darkness or Ying and Yang mentioned.
This is what is meant by the statement "unification slays duality". In order words; the two halves, spirit and matter, must return to antecedent oneness. (antecedent meaning: One that precedes another)
Bible references which support the statement:
Paul again supports the thesis when he says: "There is neither Jew nor Gentile, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male(spirit) nor female(matter), for ye are all one(unification) in Christ Jesus."
And no one can forget that impressive assurance of the Master himself(Jesus) that "when they shall arise from the dead(unconsciousness) they neither marry(spirit) nor are given in marriage(matter); but are as the angels(unified) which are in heaven" (Mark 12:25).
You said the same meaning in your very own statement, you proved my point. I inserted words in () to illustrate.
"He(Jesus) teaches us through the sanctification process and obediance lessons how to surrender to his fullness(unification). His fullness is neither male(spirit) nor female(matter).
Miki, it is good to ask questions as you learn more when you do. You are young in spirit but keep seeking and you find what you are looking for.
Love fully,
David
I had a dream the other day about the two witnesses... (I identified them that way as I recall in my dream).... One was in a wheel chair, he pointed to me and asked me to push him to a stadium where some miracle was happening as if it was by God. I remembered seeing horsemen riding around annointing people ?perhaps? (kinda foggy).. As we were going to the stadium... I saw christian radio station vans simulcasting outside and turning it into an event (you've seen them broadcast live from places handing out prizes and stuff)....
I roll the guy in... and we see something land (a space craft?). On the stadium field, I see a demon covered in blood. People were cheering. I positioned the guy close to the field. I leave because I knew I didn't want to be part of this. I knew there would be a stampede out of the stadium and I was getting a head start....
I woke up.... I felt that I could go back to sleep (as if I was suppose to) but I was too afraid to continue the dream....
who knows?
Seeing the title the two witnesses got me to thinking about my dream...
I roll the guy in... and we see something land (a space craft?). On the stadium field, I see a demon covered in blood. People were cheering. I positioned the guy close to the field. I leave because I knew I didn't want to be part of this. I knew there would be a stampede out of the stadium and I was getting a head start....
I woke up.... I felt that I could go back to sleep (as if I was suppose to) but I was too afraid to continue the dream....
who knows?
Seeing the title the two witnesses got me to thinking about my dream...
QUOTE(enok @ Jul 9 2005, 05:30 AM) [snapback]9443[/snapback]
hypothetically speaking what would your tests be to determine the authenticity of a witness?
Run up and try to wring their necks. If you vanish in a puff of smoke. They were witnesses.
QUOTE(David Santiago @ Sep 22 2005, 11:01 PM) [snapback]14277[/snapback]
Enok, here's the answer you seek.
This is truth. The two witnesses revealed for those to hear with eyes to see.
Here is the rationale of the Atonement doctrine; the two halves, spirit and matter, god and man, must return to antecedent oneness. We are sent to bathe in the Pool of Siloam so that the two halves of our nature may be made into the original whole. Earthly human wedlock is but an emblem of the greater marriage of the two elements of matter and consciousness in one organism. In the light of which we venture to suggest an entirely new and undreamed-of meaning in Jesus’ statement that man, to be regenerate, must become as a little child. The child is of neither sex, functionally; and the man returned to deity is of neither sex. The redeemed must return to the sexless state of the child. Orthodox ignorance has read into Jesus’ utterance only a return to "the simple faith and purity of childhood." But there is in this no lift to the plane of cosmic and racial significance where alone the esoteric interpretations of ancient books is to be made. The Gospels are not dealing with everyday homiletics. They expound the occult laws of evolution. Jesus was telling the race that it must return to angelic epicene state, spiritually. We must reunite the two divided sexes in us. Paul endorses the necessity when he says that the wall of partition between us must be broken down, and the two made one new creature. And the Gnostic Jesus tells Salome that his kingdom will come when there shall be neither male nor female, but when both shall be one. Paul again supports the thesis when he says: "There is neither Jew nor Gentile, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female, for ye are all one in Christ Jesus," the biune being, the Alpha and Omega of any cycle. And no one can forget that impressive assurance of the Master himself that "when they shall arise from the dead they neither marry nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven" (Mark 12:25). Sex is an appurtenance of the body only. This is the meaning of the statement in Revelation that "the dragon shall rise up and slay" the two witnesses, the two thieves between whose opposite tensions the Christ had been crucified. Unification slays duality.
There you have it folks, the truth. Let those with ears to hear, hear.
2 Corinthians 11:3
But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
2 Corinthians 1:12
For our rejoicing is this, the testimony of our conscience, that in simplicity and godly sincerity, not with fleshly wisdom, but by the grace of God, we have had our conversation in the world, and more abundantly to you-ward.
1 Corinthians 2:2
For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.
When explanations start making one's eyes cross, one is in danger of biting the fruit and being tossed out of the garden all over again--figuratively speaking, of course.
Keep it simple.
In Christ,
Mike
QUOTE(Godssoldier @ Jul 27 2005, 01:05 PM) [snapback]10356[/snapback]
The two witnesses of the LORD, have been instructed to hack off their hair and to put on sacks for clothes and to tie a rope around their waist for a belt, as a witness against the people.
When they begin their ministry, They are sent to, large congregations of people, who claim they are CHRIST'S people, Where they will be laughed at, mocked and treated spitefully. Then when the word is given by the church leaders, for them to be thrown out of the congregation, then fire will consume the young men, who try to lay hands on them, and great fear will fall on all who see it. Then the LORD'S two witnesses will speak to the sky and to the heavens, in front of these, two congregations, who have rejected them. Then lightning, thundering, and earthquakes will go out from these two different parts of the earth, over the face of the whole earth, And the two witnesses of the LORD will have given the order, that no more rain shall fall on the face of the earth, for three and a half years, or a time, times, and a half time, or one thousand two hundred and sixty days, or forty two months. Then all weather, over the face of the whole earth, will disappear, for that amount of time. Immediately the sun will cause blistering heat everywhere . It will become like a death valley summer everywhere on earth.
Although witness of these events will go out from the two congregations. Not every one on earth will know the truth about what has happened. Most people will be subject to the rumors and debates produced by the news medias and talk shows. Even the prominent scientists and leaders will give their opinions. But the truth will remain, That GOD, has begun to take away his daily sacrifice to man, and the great trouble, of which there has been none greater since there was a nation, no, nor will there be any greater, HAS BEGUN. This is also the beginning of the time period, for the setting up, of the abomination of desolation.
The two witnesses, will continue their ministry, only to be rejected by most Christian assemblies. Then not many days after the weather on earth disappears, and because the people, that call themselves, the people of GOD, will not receive correction from the LORD'S two witnesses, They will speak to the oceans and seas, in front of the congregations who have rejected them. Then going out from those two different parts of the earth, The oceans and seas, of the earth, will turn to blood. Like the blood of a dead man, and every living thing in the oceans and seas, will die.
The LORD'S two witnesses will continue their ministry, going out to more Christian congregations. Even though most of them will be in a panic by then. The two witnesses will still be mocked and treated shamefully. Then because those who speak in the name of the LORD, will not listen to the word of the LORD, through HIS two witnesses. They will speak to the inland waters, from two different parts of the earth, in front of two different congregations. Then the waters of the rivers, lakes, reservoirs, levies, canals, wells, springs, bottles, cans, and all fresh water supplies, will turn to blood, Like the blood of a dead man, And every living thing in the waters will die. Even the remainder of the polar ice caps that did not melt from the blistering heat, will turn to blood.
The slanderers of the earth will give all kinds of reasons and theories about why and what has happened. But all of their efforts to explain and to overcome, will come to nothing.
This plague of blood will change things here on earth, very rapidly. Electricity will stop, because of no water to turn their generators. Business will stop, because of no electricity. Darkness will fall on the seat of the beast, on every nation on earth. All manufacturing will stop, all over the globe. Not many days will pass, and people will abandon their homes. Because of the heat, and when they turn on their faucets and flush their toilets, blood will come out instead of water. And so after a while, EVERY HOUSE IS SHUT UP SO THAT NONE MAY GO IN.
At this point, The general public will be in a great panic.
There will be violent runs on super markets, gas stations, stores of all kinds. Finally every place that bought or sold or stored anything, will be looted and destroyed by the people. Fires will consume much, because there will be no water to put them out. Very quickly all of the supplies of everything in the world, will be gone.
Most of the people will become vicious, because of the heat and no food and water. Then those who love evil and despise GOOD will begin robbing, killing, raping, pillaging and hating each other, even their own brothers and sisters, over whatever they can find.
The LORD'S two witnesses will continue their ministry, Even though a congregation is hard to find by human standards, the SPIRIT of the LORD leads them on. Now many people have come to the knowledge of the truth. But there are many more who have not. So in front of congregations who have rejected them. They will speak the words, and great swarms of insects, both flying and crawling insects, will appear all over the earth. Then the insects will eat every remaining plant and tree. Because of the amount of meat eating and stinging insects, many people will die from this plague. Then the wild animals, even the pets that once befriended them, will turn on them in packs. The birds will start feeding on the dead bodies of people, That will start lining the streets of the cities of the world. Nuclear power plants will melt down and kill many, because of the suddenness of no water to cool them. Things will really start to escalate. Prisoners will walk out of the prisons, when they are abandoned by the people who can no longer feed and water them. The militaries and policing agencies, of the world, will disband, because they will be as worthless and vicious as everyone else, in the world.
And thus those who restrain, are taken out of the way, and the man of sin is now revealed. There will be a crying in the streets, on the hills, in the mountains and in the valleys for water, food, wine, drugs, cigarettes, medicines, all that anyone had grown fond of will be gone, And all that their souls long for they will not find. The blood in the oceans, seas, and inland water supplies will coagulate, harden and rot. The stink will go up into the air, and be hard to bare, along with the smell of rotting bodies everywhere.
All that man has created by worshiping the works of his hands, has come to nothing. All of the gold, silver, jewels, money, cars, trucks, fuels, talent, causes, knowledge, songs, ability, ministries, Nothing will be able to buy a single drop of water, to drink, or a single bite of food to eat, or a way out of the extreme heat of the days. So everyone is in the same condition, as with the rich so with the poor, as with the buyer so with the seller, as with the shepherd so with the sheep. All who have rejected the LORD and his two witnesses, are in agony.
Things will get so bad, Bands of people will form all over the world, That will start killing people and eating them for food and drinking their blood for water. They will be using, and trusting in, guns, knives, bows and arrows, cross bows, machine guns canons, airplanes, helicopters, tanks. All kinds of arms to do this thing. Now if anyone chooses this path of eating people for food and drinking blood for water. They will be sealed for destruction at the coming of the LORD. Regardless of whether it is distilled or any other deception. Those who have not found the truth by then, who would be called a child of LIGHT, will eat any other thing, Insects, animals, ect. Finally every animal will have been killed or eaten for food.
Those who have believed will be in the camps of the LORD. The LORD'S true shepherds will have started up camps where the SPIRIT of the LORD will feed the people with manna. The true shepherds will bring water out of the face of the rock to water the flocks. There will be nothing in the camps of the LORD except people. The people will be bald with their hair hacked off, it will be the same with men, women, and children. They will all be clothed in sack cloth, with a rope around their waist. Everyone will be dirty and smell like people who have not bathed in a long time. No one justified will wear any ornaments or paint on the bodies that are called the temple of GOD, because of the fear of the LORD. All of the people in the camps will give praise and thanks to the LORD day and night in fear and trembling. For the fear of the LORD had been taught by the commandments of men, teaching their god who loves perversity. But now they can see that man was wrong, and after all that has happened, The LORD has delivered them from it all. The SPIRIT of the LORD has fed and watered them and protected them with HIS fire that comes down from the sky on the heads of his enemies. The SPIRIT of the LORD is also their unseen shade from the heat of the days.
All of this will take place after the hirelings, who were in charge of the LORD'S sheep in THE GREEN WOOD, have come to nothing in the DRY. Those who divined for money and taught and prophesied for a bribe. For they could not show or tell their followers what to do to cure their ills. They were worthless because of what they believed. So some of them will become sheep needing help themselves, because of true humility. Others will try to flee the persecution of their own followers, only to find, there is no place to run. Some will be dashed to pieces, because they were treacherous dealers, Indeed they were very treacherous dealers.
Still the LORD had true shepherds out there, waiting for all of this to happen, and more sheep will be added to their flocks daily, even from the beginning of troubles. And the saying of the LORD is remembered, "WHO THEN IS A FAITHFULL AND WISE SERVANT, WHOM HIS MASTER MADE RULER OVER HIS HOUSEHOLD, TO GIVE THEM FOOD IN DUE SEASON? BLESSED IS THAT SERVANT WHOM HIS MASTER WHEN HE COMES, WILL FIND SO DOING".
The SPIRIT of the LORD will also send out to gather, the poor in spirit, the meek of the earth, the pure in heart, those who thirst after righteousness, and all who sit in sack cloth with bald heads and cry out to the LORD for comfort.
Now there will be a group of people, who will have been surviving on processed people for food, and processed blood for water, They are also a religious group. Their leaders will have stumbled onto some of the LORDS power, But by the LORD'S design. They will gain power over most of the existing world and they will have all of mans devices at their disposal. They will lie to themselves and to all who follow them. They will say that the true GOD of heaven is with them, They will show the power of GOD to prove it. They will cause many to become sacrifices for their stomach. Then when the time has been fulfilled, And when they have reestablished their T.V. transmissions, They will kill the LORD'S two witnesses, who will be together at that time, by the power of GOD. It is part of the two witnesses ministry to die.
Now the devils who will kill them, will further deceive themselves, because when the two witnesses die, the weather will return to the earth, just like it was before the two witnesses of the LORD came. Now because it has become a common thing, to let dead bodies lay where they die, over the past three and a half years, and because of fear. No one will bury the two witnesses, of the LORD. Their dead bodies will lay in the street where they are killed, for three and a half days.
The evil ones and everyone who has followed them, will be happy and full of joy, thinking that it is all over, That the two
devils who tormented those who live on the earth are dead. They will send gifts to one another and rejoice and party it up for days. They will work hard on trying to restore as much as
possible of the world, to the way it was before. For they are
lovers of the world, and this is where their hearts and minds are.
Then on the fourth day, half way through the fourth day, making it three and a half days, with their cameras in place, because of their arrogance, to disprove the rumors, The breath of life, from GOD, will inter back into the two witnesses, and they will stand up on their feet. Then a loud voice from the sky will say "COME UP HERE". Then the two witnesses, will ascend up into the sky, and go out of sight into a cloud. Great fear will fall on all who see and hear this.
Excellent prophecy Godssoldier. Praise God for that.
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QUOTE(charlie @ Oct 6 2007, 01:35 AM) [snapback]123488[/snapback]
QUOTE(Godssoldier @ Jul 27 2005, 01:05 PM) [snapback]10356[/snapback]
The two witnesses of the LORD, have been instructed to hack off their hair and to put on sacks for clothes and to tie a rope around their waist for a belt, as a witness against the people.
. . . Then the two witnesses, will ascend up into the sky, and go out of sight into a cloud. Great fear will fall on all who see and hear this.
Excellent prophecy Godssoldier. Praise God for that.
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Godssoldier was quoting a website referred to in the other Two Witnesses thread in Bible Prophecy. I'm not sure that I'll be able to insert a working link, but the URL is
http://www.geocities.com/starrgerl/inkhorn.htm
The website is called THE LITTLE BOOK FROM THE WRITERS INK HORN--THE FINAL WARNING
In the other topic, a forum member named Elijah said that the writing was his.
QUOTE
This is my writing to. I didn't know that anyone had published it. But praise the LORD. Now no one can say they didn't know.
By faith in Him alone
Charles Martin
a son of man
By faith in Him alone
Charles Martin
a son of man
Post 4929 in the Two Witnesses thread, and this is the link:
http://www.christian-forum.net/index.php?s...&#entry4929
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