In a number of recent threads I have lended my support to many Catholic arguments regarding the reverence with which Catholic's esteem Mary. In those threads I demonstrated that most of the Catholic dogmas regarding Mary have their roots in Christian belief going back to the earliest times even in the 2nd Century. So universally did Christians believe these teachings about Mary that it was not until the 4th century that any serious challenge was made to them, namely the heresy of Nestorianism which the Council of Ephesus overthrew. Even in the early stages of the reformation these Marian dogma's of Catholicism were held also by the early reformers and to this day High Anglicans and Lutherans share many of these beliefs.

It was in the years preceding the reformation that some serious dysfunctions started to appear in the church. The church started to take certain true doctrines to ridiculous extremes. The reformers reacted against these extremes and sadly took the doctrine of the reformed church into extremes the other way. A typical example was the over zealous devotion to Mary spilling over into adoration and worship. The protestants saw this and went to the other extreme neglecting Mary and going into a frenzy of iconoclasm burning down churches, destroying statues of Mary and the saints. Images, frescoes and sacred relics and objects of all kinds were destroyed. Even pipe organs and musical instruments were not spared and for almost 100 years no musical instrument was heard in protestant worship. The church of Christ to this day continue this strange legacy of the iconoclasts. Anyway I digress.

So here is where a dysfunction occurred in the church. When all those in the church who opposed the excesses of Mary worship left to join protestantism, those who were left heavily overrepresented the tendency to overly venerate Mary. So the church continued to become increasingly Marified if I can put it that way to the point where today the dedication to Mary has become an endorsed cult within the Catholic church.

So the situation we have today is a Catholic church which according to the Catechism does not worship Mary. However, and this is where I get to the crux of my argument, even though they say they don't worship Mary what do they actually DO? To determine the answer to this question I will ask the following questions of any Catholics which may be reading.

Why are there 7 times as many Hail Mary's in the rosary as there are mentions of Jesus and God?
Why are there so many more statues of Mary than Jesus in catholic churches?
Why are there hardly any statues of Jesus as a grown living man in catholic churches. They are usually of him hanging on the cross or as a baby in Mary's arms?
Why did Pope John Paul II after he was shot and when his life was is in danger call out "Mary my mother" instead of "God my Father"?
Why do people make pilgrimages to Lourdes and Fatima?
Why do people deck out statues of Mary with jewels and crowns?
Why are huge statues of Mary constructed that look out over cities?
Why are hymns and songs sung in honour of Mary?
Why do millions of people walk in processions following statues of Mary lifted up on pedestals?
Why do catholics knowingly cause offence to protestants (seperated brethren) by over using excessively gratuitous terms for Mary like "Queen of Heaven", "Holy Mother of God", "Hail Holy Queen", "Mother of Mercy", "Our life, our sweetness, our hope"
Why has a petition of six million people lobbied the pope to proclaim Mary as Co-Redemptrix?
Why was a massive assembly of the Pope, cardinals and bishops called to consecrate the entire world to the "Immaculate Heart of Mary".
Why do people weep and raise their arms and millions of candles in adoration to Mary at these assemblies.
Why do people flock to see apparitions and signs of Mary which they gaze at with expressions of adored bliss?

The way I see it if something looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then surely it must be a duck, no matter how hard we argue that it is a goose. In the same way it doesn't matter how many times Catholics argue they don't worship Mary if it is as plain as the nose on your face that they do by the evidence of their ACTIONS. One wonders that if Mary was worshipped openly as a goddess could anything more be done for her than is not already being done by Catholics.

This is a typical work of Satan, to take good teachings and good doctrines and over emphasise them and then neglect other good teachings and doctrines. Protestants are just as prone to this fault as Catholics. However this Mary worship evidenced in Catholicism is a particularly grave error which seems to be growning in ardence with each passing generation. I know that I have encouraged Catholics and Orthodox to stay in their churches and loyally obey their pastors. However be aware that you follow the teachings of the church and not necessarily the actions of those around you, even the actions of leaders of the church which are at odds with their own teachings.

A similar warning was given by Christ with regards to the Pharisees.
Matt 23:1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, 2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: 3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

Satan has plenty of tricks up his sleeve and Catholics are going to be just as prone to fall into them as Protestants. The great falling away prophecied in the last days which has already begun in Protestantism will eventually affect Catholics also in large numbers and I would not be suprised if an extreme Marian movement is what will cause Catholics to fall away, already we have the MMP (Marian movement of Priests) with their hard to grasp mystical beliefs. Satan knows how to exploit Christians using their weaknesses. I anticipate that a future pope will put the kybosh on this over-the-top Mary business and a huge faction in Catholicism will arise with an anti-pope who worships Mary. The true pope and the true Christians in his Catholic church will again be persecuted as in the days of old. Who knows. Interesting idea, which might at least be worth watching to see what develops.

Well, someone says:

If it walks like a duck, quack like a duck, but Jack Bauer says it is beef - then it´s beef.

dave hunt said

all of the great stone cathedrals in europe were built to honor mary (not jesus)

there are 100 shrines built to mary for every one shrine built to jesus

there are 100 prayers said to mary for every one prayer to jesus or the heavenly father.

in the stained glass windows of the cathedrals, it says.......(in latin).......O MARY, SAVE US!
and, mary is shown as an adult woman, carrying a baby jesus.
or a toddler jesus is walking among mary's legs.

jesus told us NOT to pray long repetitive prayers..........like the HAIL MARY.

jesus told us to not call any one here on earth FATHER

the pope claims to the HOLY FATHER,............which is the BIBLE NAME of the Heavenly Father GOD........the pope is claiming to be GOD............read John 17;11

the european RCC catholics love mary far more than they love jesus.



it's true that the protestants have gross errors in some of their beliefs, but i like to claim to be (NOT a RCC or Protestant , but) a BIBLE-BELIEVER.

when we talk, let's use bible-terms.

protestant and rcc are not mentioned in the SCRIPTURES.

Excubitor, you present some very good food for thought. I am a catholic convert and have no life long roots in any particular dogma. And while I will admit that you may be right about an "extreme Marian movement", because there are disagreements within the church on various subjects, I am in no position to take sides on any of them. I listen, read, and pray. I can only point out that the church does not endorse any idea that says not praying to Mary will endanger your salvation. Only that She can help. Worship is an altogether different animal, so to speak. Worship is the offering up of sacrifice. Jesus Christ is the ultimate sacrifice and the Mass is all about praising, thanksgiving and sacrifice to Christ. Mary almost never gets mentioned. The Rosary is nothing more than a meditative device by which we are able to zone out environmental distractions. Like the sounds of traffic, crying children and a drinking, abusive husband. So that we might focus sinle-mindedly on the kingdom of heaven. Protestants have the prayer closet and catholics have the rosary.

But, like you, I can wait and watch.

God bless you Excubitor,
sojourner

Huh? Which protestants? There are 8,196 Protestant denominations according to David Barrett's study (1970). Can you be specific? Which denominations, what gross errors?

@dennis mann :- A word of advice do not type names in lower case always in upper case. .