Science and Scripture
In Defense of the Faith
Wednesday, February 21, 2007
Jack Kinsella - Omega Letter Editor

"Canst thou draw out leviathan with an hook? or his tongue with a cord which thou lettest down?" (Job 41:1)


The Book of Job is generally the first place Christians turn when they want to see how best to stand up to the trials and tribulations of life. I once knew a pastor who counseled his congregation about patience.
He told them, "Before you pray for patience, read the Book of Job and find out how you get it, first." Good advice. Patience is learning to trust God to see you safely through the rapids of life.

Being sinful, fallen creatures, it takes a couple of trips through the rapids to convince us, first. (In that sense, praying for patience is like praying for a slicker and a paddle.)

But the Book of Job is much more than a narrative about patience and reward. The Book of Job is rich with evidences of God's Truth. In Job, God reveals much about science, nature, physics, astronomy and geography. Details that no single person living in the ancient times of Job could possibly know. Especially not someone living in the Middle Eastern desert.

For centuries, man believed that the earth was flat. Christopher Columbus was criticized for setting sail to the other side of the earth, they expected Columbus to sail off the edge of the earth.

But Job noted that "He walks above the circle of heaven". (Job 22:14) The original Hebrew, using Roman characters, is, "Choq- chag `al- pney- mayim `ad-takliyt 'owr `im- choshek."

The word translated as circle comes from the Hebrew word "chuwg" which transliterates into English as 'circuit' or 'sphere' in addition to 'circle'.

Early man thought Atlas, a huge turtle or elephants held up the earth. In the North sky within the millions of stars is a vast expanse of blackness.

Job 26:7 says the earth is suspended on nothing. The Bible was before the telescope so only God could describe it. Today we know it is gravity that holds the planets and stars in their orbits making them appears to be hung on nothing.

Job 28:25 says air has weight. Science confirms air is about 50 miles thick, exactly the right composition to support life. It's perfect for our lungs. The air filters deadly rays. If the earth was 10% larger or smaller all would die. We are in a fragile balance before the sun between frying and freezing.

Job 26:10 says; "He hath compassed the waters with bounds, until the day and night come to an end." (KJV) The RSV translates it; "He has described a circle upon the face of the waters at the boundary between light and darkness."

In any case, it is clear Job knew the earth was round millennia before Columbus. Who told him?

Job 36:27:28 explains the hydrological cycle, the condensation and hydrology maintain life, provide evaporation, transportation, precipitation and run-off .

He describes the repeated cycle of precipitation, its evaporation, and condensation in the clouds.

In addition, Solomon wrote in Ecclesiastes 1:6; “The wind blows to the south and goes round to the north; round and round goes the wind, and on its circuits with wind returns.”

It took modern science to document the direction of wind currents and wind paths. Who told Job and Solomon?

About 4,000 years ago, Job says; "Hast thou commanded the morning since thy days; and caused the dayspring to know his place;" adding, "It is TURNED as clay to the seal." (v14)

Job paints a word picture here using a clay pot on a potter's wheel as an analogy.

Job 38:16 tells us there are springs in the sea (this was not known until 1913 when they found underground rivers). So who told Job?

Job 38:22 mentions the treasures of the snow. Each flake is of perfect dimensions and all are different. The snow is beneficial for nitrogen for fertilizer. How often do you think it snowed in southern Iraq where Job most likely lived?

Water is heavier than air, and is transported in clouds. “Dost thou know the balancing of the clouds, the wondrous works of Him who is perfect in knowledge?” (Job 37:16)

Job lived in the Middle East some four thousand years ago. The Book of Job, chronologically speaking, is the oldest Book of the Bible.

"Out of whose womb came the ice? and the hoary frost of heaven, who hath gendered it? The waters are hid as with a stone, and the face of the deep is frozen." (Job 38:29-30)

Who told Job about ice and snow? How did a guy living 4000 years ago in the Middle East know about the permanent polar ice caps, 'hid as with a stone, and the face of the deep is frozen'? An Eskimo with wanderlust? What would a desert-bound nomad know about 'the deep' in the first place?

Job 38:31 explains the solar system. The Hebrew speaks of a pivot or hinge. In the South-Southwest is the Pleiades, 7 stars making up the center of the solar system.

Amos 5:8 says the Pleiades consists of 7 stars. The seventh star was only discovered in the last century because with the naked eye one can see only 6.

Some time back, a series of 14 human footprints with at least 134 dinosaur tracks were discovered in the bed of the Paluxy River, near Glen Rose, Texas. Bible-haters have come up with thousands of explanations, but one explanation is no more reasonable than another.

According to Job, there lived in his day, a beast he termed 'behemoth'. It is described in Job 40:15-24 as "eating grass like an ox" that "moves his tail like a cedar" -- the Hebrew literally says; “he lets hang his tail like a cedar.” "Its “bones are like beams of bronze . . . His ribs like bars of iron. . . “He is the first of the ways of God. . .” “He lies under the lotus trees,In a covert of reeds and marsh. . . ”

Some translations translate 'behemoth' as 'elephant' or 'hippopotamus'. A key phrase is, “He is the first of the ways of God.” This phrase in the original Hebrew implied that behemoth was the biggest animal created.

Then there is leviathan. The Bible describes 'leviathan' in Job 41 this way:

"Canst thou draw out leviathan with an hook? or his tongue with a cord which thou lettest down?" (41:1) "Shall the companions make a banquet of him? shall they part him among the merchants? Canst thou fill his skin with barbed irons? or his head with fish spears?) (v6-7)

"None is so fierce that dare stir him up: who then is able to stand before Me?" (v10)

Who can open the doors of his face? his teeth are terrible round about" (v14).

Sound like an elephant? Or a hippopotamus? Job describes the physical appearance of leviathan:

"His scales are his pride, shut up together as with a close seal. One is so near to another, that no air can come between them. They are joined one to another, they stick together, that they cannot be sundered." (v15-16)

"Out of his mouth go burning lamps, and sparks of fire leap out. Out of his nostrils goeth smoke, as out of a seething pot or caldron His breath kindleth coals, and a flame goeth out of his mouth." (v19-21)

"When he raiseth up himself, the mighty are afraid: by reason of breakings they purify themselves." (v25)

THIS is a pretty convincing description. The 'mighty' 'purify' themselves by reasons of 'breakings' at the sight of leviathan. (We have a phrase for that in English, too. And a product. It's called "Depends").

Every culture is filled with stories of fire-breathing dragons. The first dinosaur bones were discovered in 1822 by Mary Ann Mantell. (The word 'dinosaur' was coined in 1841)

If the ancients had never seen a dinosaur, where did the fire-breathing dragons of old come from? And if Job had never seen one, who told him about them 4000 years before the first bones were discovered? (Even if dinosaur bones were common in Job's day, paleontologists were not.)

The Book of Job teaches a lot more than merely how to be patient and trust in the Lord. It teaches that an itinerant nomad in the middle of the Arabian desert knew more about science four thousand years ago than science knew at the dawn of the 20th century.

Although Job told us that light was in motion, (Job 38:19) it took Einstein before anybody believed it.

As noted, Job is the oldest Book in the Bible, penned before Moses wrote Genesis and set historically almost a thousand years earlier than the Exodus from Egypt.

Job didn't have access to large collections of books about natural science, geography, climatology or physics.

Neither did he have access to the writings of the prophets or the promises of the New Testament. Job had never been taught of the Rapture, the Resurrection or of a coming Redeemer in the last days. But he knew.

Job confidently wrote, "For I know that my Redeemer liveth, and that He shall stand at the LATTER DAY UPON THE EARTH: And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet IN MY FLESH shall I see God: Whom I shall see FOR MYSELF, and mine eyes shall behold, and NOT ANOTHER; though my reins be consumed within me." (Job 19:25-27)

Who told Job all these things? The same One Who told you.

"For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of His majesty." (2 Peter 1:16)

"Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge Him, and He shall direct thy paths." (Proverbs 3:5-6)

.............................................benny

Quite insightful. May the Lord bless you, Benny.

Your sister in Christ, Angela

Thank you so much for this needed confirmation of my entire platform, quest and calling in Christ. When we trust in the Lord, i.e. scientists gifted by God to see what others cannot see, then the hidden truths and the hidden treasures that were once obscured by "cunningly devised fables" and vain misinterpretations are, alas, revealed to the Wise in Christ. The problem is getting people to listen and understand, those whose minds have been dulled by the traditions of lingering misinterpretations of the Holy Scriptures. May the Lord open the way for this Herculean task, for only in Him are all things possible. Thank you, again.

Are there two Seven Thunders on here? One believes scripture and one doesn't, it seems.

Oh the awesomeness of God. I have so many favorite passages, as I am sure you all have to. I love the last four chapters of Job because...

...it show's just how majestic God is. Satan wants to kill Job, but God says you can hurt him but you can't kill him. He has three friends come from a distance and start ridiculing him because Job must have done something wrong, otherwise why would God punish him like this?

Job had it all, beautiful wife and children, land, oxen, barns over flowing with crops, but he lost it all and Satan put boils all over his body, destroying his family and crops. For the first thirty some chapters of Job his friends let him have it, judging him unmercifully. Through it all Job's faith in God didn't waiver.

Then his friends leave and Job is left broken and destitute. At about that time Job finally starts doubting God and even questions him. About that time God comes and ask why do you doubt me? He tells Job to pull himself up by his bootstraps and listen up!

And he says..."where were you when I laid the foundations of the world... Does the lightning come to you and ask where should we go next? Does the waves go no farther than you tell them too? Do you know whre the snow is stored?" On and on God reveals his vastness, a jaw dropping testimony from God himself.

In the end Job is humbled and kicks himself for ever doubting his creator. After his lecture and Job remains faithful, God not only restores what Job had lost, but gave him back everything more abundant than before.

Read the last four chapters of Job and you'll see the awesomeness of Him.

Thank you Lord for your Word.

I was in a discussion on evolution a couple of weeks ago and this person and I was talking and I mentioned "the toughest bug on earth." Its Latin name means "strange berry that withstands radiation." It can withstand thousands of times the radiation that would kill a human. The bacterium was first isolated in the 1950's, but a scientist who began studying the bug in 1988 said, "I had difficulty believing anything like this could exist."

Many bacteria form hard capsules around themselves in response to radiation. While this provides some protection, the "strange berry" doesn't form a capsule, and still survives better than any other bug. While 500 to 1,000 rads of radiation would kill a human being, the "strange berry" can withstand 1.5 million rads. The radiation shatters the "berry's" DNA into hundreds of fragments, a hundred times the fragmentation that is fatal to other bacteria. But a couple of hours later, the DNA is stitched back together, free of all mutations.

Evolutionists are puzzled because there is no environment containing this much radiation. Why would evolution develop such a creature? The "strange berry" not only challenges evolution directly, but also declares the skill and wisdom of its Creator!

The woman I was talking with said it is just a coincidence.

I said Coincidence? You mean like male and female's evolving at the same time?. The problem is, if a mutation produced the first male, it isn't likely that another mutation would have produced the first female at the same time and in the same neighborhood. Studies now show that with the current genetic errors we all carry within us, one male and one female would not be enough to establish a new population of male and female creatures.

The question is important. Evolutionists have admitted that their theory does not have a satisfactory explanation for how male and female could have developed.

Evolutionists also point out that the problems in explaining the origins of male and female are even greater than those I've already mentioned. They now admit that their studies show that if creatures progress by evolution, creatures who reproduce sexually would be at a disadvantage. Even worse, sexual reproduction is, as one evolutionist put it, designed to weed out the very genetic variations that supposedly cause evolution!

It is difficult to understand, then, how anyone could say coincidence offers a better explanation of life than the Bible’s creation account.

Seriously, put your gaurd down for a moment and put the ole thinking cap on. Evolution could not possibly of happened. Vegas would give odds probably of a trillion to one.

Barnabas

References: John Travis, Meet the Superbug, Science News, December 1998, v.154, p.376

No, there's just one "THE SEVEN THUNDERS". Me. The same exact "THE SEVEN THUNDERS" that you all have been persecuting on another thread, merely for me trying to tell you all (if you would just open your hearts, minds and eyes) of a totally different perspective that appears alien to you due to its newness and uniqueness, due to the fact no one has ever heard it before, for I have not yet published my research, and also due to long-held traditional (mis)interpretations to Scripture which my new scientific research progresses to a deeper unveiling of TRUTH that, simultaneously, is still held within the parameters of the Holy Scriptures, and supports the Holy Bible entirely. I am not an Atheist, as I have been falsely accused. I am a "Born Again" Christian. My research disproves the Evolution/Uniformitarian Model, which I can prove in a court of law, is completely false and severe misinterpretation of the data. Their gargantuan dating of the Solar System to be 5 billion-years old is a radical overestimation. Much of established Conventional Science is skewed due to its premise being based on the false and erroneous foundation of Evolutionism. Creationism is far closer to the TRUTH, but it's not quite there yet; parts of it are "off" and need "adjustment". THIS DOESN'T MEAN THAT I AM SAYING THE BIBLE IS WRONG OR THAT I DON'T BELIEVE IN THE SCRIPTURES. I have attempted to relay some of these "adjustments", but because the typical Christian is so "conditioned" by the "traditional interpretation" of the 6 Days of Creation into a literal 6,000-year age of the Creation, they cannot see that beyond this is a more accurate interpretation that is a hidden treasure from God yet to be unlocked. Once Christians realize this hidden truth and it is allowed to be released, then it will completely annihilate the Evolution/Uniformitarian Model into absolute oblivion, and make Evolutionism equal in ridiculousness to the "Hollow Earth Theory". In fact, after this is achieved the world won't even believe that such a preposterous theory (Evolution) was ever endorsed by Humankind. Simultaneously, it will further confirm the Bible to be factual and true, not even one iota of the Word of God will be or needs to be altered in any fashion, the two will mesh perfectly, as hand in glove.

...lay your weapons down, sweetness...

This is so true. Particularly about the creation of male and female, simultaneously. My research indicates that the complimentary genders of male and female are integral for the existence of the “Trans-Universal Superstructure” at all whatsoever, and this reciprocating communalism between the male and female are actually one of the prime attributes of the building blocks of the Universe. This can be found in the new emergent hyperphysics of Super Symmetry and Superstring M-Theory. From the quantum equations superstrings, the building blocks of matter composed of quarks, ferons and bosons, theoretically vibrate and have two antipodal ends. What is fascinating is that one end to a superstring vibrates (oscillates) at a set velocity rate in one rotational direction, say a clockwise rotation, while its diametrically opposite end vibrates at a completely different velocity rate in a counter clockwise rotational direction, yet the two are “married” into a singular unit, a “wed-locked union”. Thus, one end is “male” (positively charged), and the opposite end is “female” (negatively charged), yet they are ONE. This is even a fundamental aspect to the principles of electricity (electromagnetism). To create a “unified current” the joining of a “male” connector and “female” connector are required. Without both, simultaneously, the harnessing of a unified current of electricity is impossble.

Excellent information, thank you.





Change your example as some could shoot holes through it because...the male and female fittings are connecting the same current, not a positigve to a negative. Also a "splice" could work instead of a male and female connectors, just an FYI. Great info though, would love to hear more.

You got my attention. Evolution is the GREAT CON of mankind. Hitler used it to usher in his agenda, public schools in USA still teach the lies that have been disproven, and the theory itself consistantly can not hold up under close scrutiny, therefore from time to time they change their theory, desperately (sp?) trying to outrun the truth.

Would love to hear as much as you are willing to share at this point. I will challenge you if need be, but I am really interested in what you have to say. I want to learn more. Thanks.

Barnabas

Evolution is a great con. It simply didn't happen that way. Even if people choose not to acknowledge the truth.

Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

Jesus confirmed the day's length, and, obviously, from one daybreak to the next is 24 hours;

John 11:9 Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day? If any man walketh in the day, he stumbleth not, because he sees the light of this world.

Since Jesus was the Word- John 1:14, And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotton of the Father,) full of grace and truth.- and since He was present in the beginning- John 1:1, In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.- it is obvious that He would know just how long a day of creation was.

Even if it does not appear that way. (Weeds out the unfaithful and the unbelievers.)

In Christ, Angela