[meli]

HeIsFaithful, on Aug 14 2008, 11:42 AM, said:

I am reading Foxe's Book of Martyrs.. and can't help but wonder.. if the Lord did not deliver them, why? or what in the "christian church of today" makes us more worthy than they to escape persecution that must come?

I wonder this too. And WHICH Christian Church? There is much talk of the "church" but there are so many splits it is beyond mind spinning. Believers yes, but believers of what? It all breaks down to a simplified answer I know, which makes me wonder why we complicate things in the first place!

[ozell]

meli, on Aug 16 2008, 08:25 AM, said:

HeIsFaithful, on Aug 14 2008, 11:42 AM, said:

I am reading Foxe's Book of Martyrs.. and can't help but wonder.. if the Lord did not deliver them, why? or what in the "christian church of today" makes us more worthy than they to escape persecution that must come?

I wonder this too. And WHICH Christian Church? There is much talk of the "church" but there are so many splits it is beyond mind spinning. Believers yes, but believers of what? It all breaks down to a simplified answer I know, which makes me wonder why we complicate things in the first place!

Man has not learned to obey God

Acts 5:29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

[lesliefain]

Where do you find that date in psalms????

I have studied prophesy a long time. Helena Lehmans books first pointed me to look at the psalms and I have read alot. I have put together a map but it is large and I cannot post it here. I am going to try to put it into a pdf form and see if it is readable. I have tried to make it as simple as possible. If anyone is interested in seeing it just pm me your email address and I will send it.

This post has been edited by lesliefain: 17 August 2008 - 06:36 PM

[benny balerio]

lesliefain, on Aug 14 2008, 12:15 AM, said:

1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition


Doesn't this scripture say that the antichrist must be revealed before our gathering together unto Jesus? Where have we gotten the belief that we are to go before he is revealed? So many Christians believe we are going soon and when it doesn't happen could this then be the falling away? I have been studying prophesy and came across this because I too have been thinking that the rapture happens before the antichrist is revealed and now I don't know how our belief of the rapture happening before the antichrist is revealed came into existence. Can anyone show me scripture on this? Psalm 108 states that the beloved will be delivered and psalm 108 is believed to be the year 2008. So based on that I believe the church of philadelphia is the beloved. Then in psalm 109 it talks of satan which many believe that the antichrist will be revealed in 2009. I am wanting to go so bad but I have to look at scripture and see what it says. So then the main rapture would be Sep 19, 2009 not this year except for the church of philadelphia. My mind is tired right now so maybe this is a dumb question!

Dear lesliefain,
It is not an absolute that we will know the identity of the anti-christ, but it is possible.The scriptire that you are referring to,I believe is meant for national Israel.(John 5:43) I am COME in my Father's NAME, and ye receive me not: if another shall COME IN HIS OWN NAME , him ye will receive. The Lord was referring to the anti-christ.When the Lord rode into Jerusalem on a little donkey,it was a special day,...a day of their visitation,...a day as to whether the jews would except or reject Him as thier long awaited Lord and Messiah.So the Lord, gave the Gentiles the same opportunity, but with the added purpose to make the Jews jealous,....at the end of the tribulation or one could call it the time of jacobs trouble.....all of Israel will be saved as prophecied.
But at the beginning of the tribulation,...The Jews have not yet recognized Jesus as their long awaited Messiah, carring that same attitude of unbelief as they did during His first coming.They cruxified the Lord Jesus, and kept on sacraficing animals, as they will do again when the third temple is built.
When the tribulation begins, the Jews will believe that the anti-christ is the messiah. Thus the prophecy,.."John 5:43) I am COME in my Father's NAME, and ye receive me not: if another shall COME IN HIS OWN NAME , him ye will receive.
The Jews will not recognize who the anti-christ really is until the "Abomination of Desolation" comes to pass.It is at that time the Jews will flee for their lives.It is the event of the "Abomination Of Desolation" that is the "revealing of the anti-christ"

...................................................benny

[Dan]

lesliefain, on Aug 13 2008, 11:15 PM, said:

1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition


Doesn't this scripture say that the antichrist must be revealed before our gathering together unto Jesus? Where have we gotten the belief that we are to go before he is revealed? So many Christians believe we are going soon and when it doesn't happen could this then be the falling away? I have been studying prophesy and came across this because I too have been thinking that the rapture happens before the antichrist is revealed and now I don't know how our belief of the rapture happening before the antichrist is revealed came into existence. Can anyone show me scripture on this? Psalm 108 states that the beloved will be delivered and psalm 108 is believed to be the year 2008. So based on that I believe the church of philadelphia is the beloved. Then in psalm 109 it talks of satan which many believe that the antichrist will be revealed in 2009. I am wanting to go so bad but I have to look at scripture and see what it says. So then the main rapture would be Sep 19, 2009 not this year except for the church of philadelphia. My mind is tired right now so maybe this is a dumb question!

The problem is you have false doctrine stacked on top of false doctrine stacked on top of false doctrine.

There is no rapture. Christ is coming here no one is going there.

The Antichrists were here in the time of Apostle John. They are all over the place including a self proclaimed nation of them over in the middle east.

The falling away happened when the Last christian displaying the Power of God bearing witness of them was murdered by the Antichrists.

So where does that leave you?

Any more questions? We would be happy to answer them.







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