[chrio39]

Dean, I find that amazing though I have a difficult time grasping it, which is humbling. The exactness of the wheel as you have explained it confirms in a tangible way that God guided man as the canon of scripture was chosen. This really settles the issue of the 'lost' books of the bible and the Catholic bible as well. And what a revelation in the center of Lamentations. That significance cannot be overstated.

[Shekel]

bibletime, on Apr 6 2008, 05:28 PM, said:

Hi Shekel, Dean,

Would you like to make a bible wheel? What are the correct order of the books? Pauls epistles start with 1 & 2 Thessalonians.

To me the correct order of the books is irrelevant (although they are unquestionably in a logical order of some kind), the point is that this is the order of the canon as it stands today in most bibles throughout the world and is the order of the canon throughout much of past history. The present order creates a remarkable pattern and demonstrates, if nothing else, God's sovereignty to work out everything into conformity to His will, even that of the choosing of the order of the canon as used by the great vast number of Protestant Christians.

Eph 1:11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

[bibletime]

Shekel, on Apr 7 2008, 07:13 AM, said:

To me the correct order of the books is irrelevant (although they are unquestionably in a logical order of some kind)

Eph 1:11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

Thank you for the verse, please go to Acts 17:1-34. After Acts 16:10 when they went into Macedonia and were at Philippi, it says passing through Amphipolis and Apollonia, they came to Thessalonica, 17:1. Go to the books of the Thessalonians, you'll find that it says they were written from Athens, Acts 17:16.

[crownsevenalphabet]

Shekel, on Apr 6 2008, 09:19 AM, said:

chrio39, on Apr 5 2008, 08:35 PM, said:

In the 1st article that you gave a link to they note that the book of Isaiah has 66 books, and a quote from a writer that speaks of the uniqueness of the book in that it gives the history of God with his people as well as prophecy of his future work with his people, especially in chapters 40 and 53. There are 66 books in the bible, in both testaments. Isaiah deals with all of God's dealings with man. 66 is 3 times 22.

We all know that God is triune - Father, Son & Spirit, as well as man - body, soul & spirit - the number 3. 22 - number of Hebrew alphabet characters, and chapters of the book of Revelation.

Also, a side thought. In Psalm 22 David prophesied of Jesus in vs 14 "I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint"

Though the old and new testaments are separated (out of joint), they are yet connected.

There are other interesting things that give credence to the basic concept of the bible wheel (although taken into the hugely subjective) is that the very middle of the wheel, that is the middle of the seven sections, is the book of Lamentations (the 25th book of the bible, but middle of the seven sections). I thought check this out because I figured the middle should be significant if there was something to it. (The middle of seven is usually significant.) This middle section of the major prophets has Lamentations as its unusual middle book because it was put after Jeremiah since he wrote it. (Unusual in that it appear to not be prophetic but it is!) When I realized that it was Lamentations at the middle I immediately remembered that the verse at the middle of that book was distinctive, set there on purpose. The book has 5 chapters, and chapter 3:1 the middle is where it suddenly and unexpectedly becomes prophetic in that all the suffering of Jerusalem is personified in Jesus, "I am the man who has seen affliction by the rod of his wrath!"

The book of Lamentation is like a mini bible wheel. It is made up of 5 acrostics where each verse begins with a letter of the alphabet beginning with aleph ("A" to "Z" if it were in our language.) This is just like the bible wheel. The first of the 5 acrostics is 66 verses long, the next is 66, then 66 (laid out differently, see next) then 44 then 22.

(22 x 3 lines long) + (22 x 3 lines long) + (66 x 1 line long) + (22 x 2 lines long) + (22 x 1 lines long) = 264 Hebrew lines of text with Lam. 3:1 at the middle as the 133rd line, beginning with "Aleph" (Alpha). "Ani ha-geber", "I AM the Man!" (and the middle of the 5th section is the word "man" {eish}, last word of the 33rd line), and the last word of this 3rd section in Lamentation is the word "YHWH". The total of the 264 lines obviously reflects the fact that this makes 22 x 12 lines of Hebrew text, one for every tribe of Israel, which is the theme of the book.

So 5 acrostics of Jeremiah located in the middle of the 5 major prophets, which is in the middle of the seven sections of the canon of the bible, with the canon being laid out in three sections of 22 letters (66). Now that is not a coincidence, but a sign of God's great sovereignty. So I have no doubt in the basic premise of the bible wheel. It is just when all the gematria is added to try to tie in individual spokes that I have a problem. It then becomes far too subjective.


The Timing of When the Wheel Was Discovered

The very morning that this person discovered the bible wheel is on a day and year and hour (May 12th, 1995) that if I had to try to come up with a more perfect hour for such a discovery to be made I could not have! And this person is unaware of it because it is something the Lord revealed to me about the bible calendar back around that time and he makes no mention of its significance anywhere on his site as far as I can see, other than to say that on that date he had a flash of revelation from God that the canon was to be wound up like one scroll. On the 360 calendar, that day was the morning of the 3rd month, the 8th day, 3440 years (430 x 8 years) after Mount Sinai in the middle of the seven days of the convenant given to Moses on Mount Sinai at the time of the exodus--- exactly to the hour. (This is when the bible first began to be given to man as we know it.) See "Jubilee-exodus-chart-bible-prophecy."

The revelation of the bible wheel even occurred on the morning that it was discovered (May 12, 1995), something that I make clear in the above document as significant (written year ago), that is, that the seven days that Moses received the covenant had to have begun at the very start (evening) of the 5th day (3rd month), which is the start of Pentecost as per Jewish tradition, thus making 3.5 days later the morning of the 8th day, and the exact middle of the week that the covenant was made, including the giving of the 10 commandments. The cycles of 430 years are fundamental to the entire numeric fabric of the bible. (They were 430 years in Egypt, another 430 x 2 until the fall of Jerusalem in 586 BC, etc., etc. 430 x 3 = 1290 of Daniel 12.) See Daniel 9 about the covenant and "to seal up vision and prophecy".

So I personally have no doubt about the validity of this discovery about the canon of Scripture on several levels of reasoning. It is just that there are many examples of forcing things on the level of trying to unit the "spokes" on the wheel. The basic pattern fits. But uniting verse to verse by the wheel does not seem to me to be the purpose of the wheel, and most examples given to try to prove such are forced.

The 176 verses of the Psalm 119, includes the full Hebrew 22 alphabet, are the foundation of my
work in crownsevenalphabet research :

http://thecrownseven...-alphabets.html

Shekel :
I know in the Bible codes, that the acrostic terms are important . . . Have you examined the
following ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psalm_119
Psalm 119 (Greek numbering: Psalm 118) is the longest psalm as well as the longest chapter in the Bible. It is referred to in Hebrew by its opening words, "Ashrei temimei derech" ("happy are those whose way is perfect"). It is the prayer of one who delights in and lives by the Torah, the sacred law. Each verse of the psalm employs a synonym for the Torah, such as dabar ("word, promise") mishpatim ("rulings"), etc.

The 176 verses of the Psalm are divided into 22 stanzas of eight lines each: one stanza for each letter of the Hebrew alphabet. In the first stanza, each of the 8 lines begin with aleph, the first letter of the alphabet; in the next stanza, each of the lines begin with bet, the second letter, and so on through the entire alphabet. Poems that use patterns involving the initial letter of a line are called acrostics; Psalm 119 is one of about a dozen alphabetic acrostic poems in the Bible.



A Haredi Jew reading Psalm 119 at the Western Wall

The acrostic form and the use of the Torah words constitute the framework for an elaborate prayer. The grounds for the prayer are established in the first two stanzas (alef and beth): the Torah is held up as a source of blessing and right conduct, and the psalmist pledges to dedicate himself to the law. The prayer proper begins in the third stanza (gimel, v. 17). Like many other psalms, this prayer includes both dramatic lament (e.g. verses 81-88) joyous praise (e.g., verses 45-48) and prayers for life, deliverance and vindication (e.g., verses 132-134). What makes Psalm 119 unique is the way that these requests are continually and explicitly grounded in the gift of the Torah and the psalmist's loyalty to it.

[Shekel]

crownsevenalphabet, on Apr 7 2008, 09:02 AM, said:

Shekel, on Apr 6 2008, 09:19 AM, said:

chrio39, on Apr 5 2008, 08:35 PM, said:

In the 1st article that you gave a link to they note that the book of Isaiah has 66 books, and a quote from a writer that speaks of the uniqueness of the book in that it gives the history of God with his people as well as prophecy of his future work with his people, especially in chapters 40 and 53. There are 66 books in the bible, in both testaments. Isaiah deals with all of God's dealings with man. 66 is 3 times 22.

We all know that God is triune - Father, Son & Spirit, as well as man - body, soul & spirit - the number 3. 22 - number of Hebrew alphabet characters, and chapters of the book of Revelation.

Also, a side thought. In Psalm 22 David prophesied of Jesus in vs 14 "I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint"

Though the old and new testaments are separated (out of joint), they are yet connected.

There are other interesting things that give credence to the basic concept of the bible wheel (although taken into the hugely subjective) is that the very middle of the wheel, that is the middle of the seven sections, is the book of Lamentations (the 25th book of the bible, but middle of the seven sections). I thought check this out because I figured the middle should be significant if there was something to it. (The middle of seven is usually significant.) This middle section of the major prophets has Lamentations as its unusual middle book because it was put after Jeremiah since he wrote it. (Unusual in that it appear to not be prophetic but it is!) When I realized that it was Lamentations at the middle I immediately remembered that the verse at the middle of that book was distinctive, set there on purpose. The book has 5 chapters, and chapter 3:1 the middle is where it suddenly and unexpectedly becomes prophetic in that all the suffering of Jerusalem is personified in Jesus, "I am the man who has seen affliction by the rod of his wrath!"

The book of Lamentation is like a mini bible wheel. It is made up of 5 acrostics where each verse begins with a letter of the alphabet beginning with aleph ("A" to "Z" if it were in our language.) This is just like the bible wheel. The first of the 5 acrostics is 66 verses long, the next is 66, then 66 (laid out differently, see next) then 44 then 22.

(22 x 3 lines long) + (22 x 3 lines long) + (66 x 1 line long) + (22 x 2 lines long) + (22 x 1 lines long) = 264 Hebrew lines of text with Lam. 3:1 at the middle as the 133rd line, beginning with "Aleph" (Alpha). "Ani ha-geber", "I AM the Man!" (and the middle of the 5th section is the word "man" {eish}, last word of the 33rd line), and the last word of this 3rd section in Lamentation is the word "YHWH". The total of the 264 lines obviously reflects the fact that this makes 22 x 12 lines of Hebrew text, one for every tribe of Israel, which is the theme of the book.

So 5 acrostics of Jeremiah located in the middle of the 5 major prophets, which is in the middle of the seven sections of the canon of the bible, with the canon being laid out in three sections of 22 letters (66). Now that is not a coincidence, but a sign of God's great sovereignty. So I have no doubt in the basic premise of the bible wheel. It is just when all the gematria is added to try to tie in individual spokes that I have a problem. It then becomes far too subjective.


The Timing of When the Wheel Was Discovered

The very morning that this person discovered the bible wheel is on a day and year and hour (May 12th, 1995) that if I had to try to come up with a more perfect hour for such a discovery to be made I could not have! And this person is unaware of it because it is something the Lord revealed to me about the bible calendar back around that time and he makes no mention of its significance anywhere on his site as far as I can see, other than to say that on that date he had a flash of revelation from God that the canon was to be wound up like one scroll. On the 360 calendar, that day was the morning of the 3rd month, the 8th day, 3440 years (430 x 8 years) after Mount Sinai in the middle of the seven days of the convenant given to Moses on Mount Sinai at the time of the exodus--- exactly to the hour. (This is when the bible first began to be given to man as we know it.) See "Jubilee-exodus-chart-bible-prophecy."

The revelation of the bible wheel even occurred on the morning that it was discovered (May 12, 1995), something that I make clear in the above document as significant (written year ago), that is, that the seven days that Moses received the covenant had to have begun at the very start (evening) of the 5th day (3rd month), which is the start of Pentecost as per Jewish tradition, thus making 3.5 days later the morning of the 8th day, and the exact middle of the week that the covenant was made, including the giving of the 10 commandments. The cycles of 430 years are fundamental to the entire numeric fabric of the bible. (They were 430 years in Egypt, another 430 x 2 until the fall of Jerusalem in 586 BC, etc., etc. 430 x 3 = 1290 of Daniel 12.) See Daniel 9 about the covenant and "to seal up vision and prophecy".

So I personally have no doubt about the validity of this discovery about the canon of Scripture on several levels of reasoning. It is just that there are many examples of forcing things on the level of trying to unit the "spokes" on the wheel. The basic pattern fits. But uniting verse to verse by the wheel does not seem to me to be the purpose of the wheel, and most examples given to try to prove such are forced.

The 176 verses of the Psalm 119, includes the full Hebrew 22 alphabet, are the foundation of my
work in crownsevenalphabet research :

http://thecrownseven...-alphabets.html

Shekel :
I know in the Bible codes, that the acrostic terms are important . . . Have you examined the
following ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psalm_119
Psalm 119 (Greek numbering: Psalm 118) is the longest psalm as well as the longest chapter in the Bible. It is referred to in Hebrew by its opening words, "Ashrei temimei derech" ("happy are those whose way is perfect"). It is the prayer of one who delights in and lives by the Torah, the sacred law. Each verse of the psalm employs a synonym for the Torah, such as dabar ("word, promise") mishpatim ("rulings"), etc.

The 176 verses of the Psalm are divided into 22 stanzas of eight lines each: one stanza for each letter of the Hebrew alphabet. In the first stanza, each of the 8 lines begin with aleph, the first letter of the alphabet; in the next stanza, each of the lines begin with bet, the second letter, and so on through the entire alphabet. Poems that use patterns involving the initial letter of a line are called acrostics; Psalm 119 is one of about a dozen alphabetic acrostic poems in the Bible.



A Haredi Jew reading Psalm 119 at the Western Wall

The acrostic form and the use of the Torah words constitute the framework for an elaborate prayer. The grounds for the prayer are established in the first two stanzas (alef and beth): the Torah is held up as a source of blessing and right conduct, and the psalmist pledges to dedicate himself to the law. The prayer proper begins in the third stanza (gimel, v. 17). Like many other psalms, this prayer includes both dramatic lament (e.g. verses 81-88) joyous praise (e.g., verses 45-48) and prayers for life, deliverance and vindication (e.g., verses 132-134). What makes Psalm 119 unique is the way that these requests are continually and explicitly grounded in the gift of the Torah and the psalmist's loyalty to it.

I went to the link at your blog but there is not mention of the book of Lamentations, only Psalm 119, which is an acrostic like that found in Lamentations. The importance of the book Lamentation is that it is at the center of the Canon when seen on the Bible Wheel, and that Lamentations is like a Bible Wheel itself, as explained before. I am not saying there is no importance to Psalm 119, but as far as additional evidence for the existence of the Bible Wheel is concerned, I am saying that in my mind the placement of Lamentations within the canon of the bible cannot be chance, not when it is true to the very middle letter. It is true to the letter, chapter, and book as far as mimicking the symmetry of the Bible Wheel. A wheel within a wheel at the center of the Bible Wheel!

The fact that the book of Lamentations is often contested as to where it really belongs in the canon of Scripture as to its order only tells me that it is where it should be, a maverick book at the center of the seven-fold division of the Canon! We should expect that this middle book be somehow different, just as Genesis and Revelation are different in that each of these are obvious as to where they should, and have, gone in the Canon. Genesis is a book of beginnings, whereas Revelation is a book about the end! The beginning and the end of the Canon. Makes sense right? And the maverick Lamentations at the center, itself an acrostic with a center after the style of the whole Canon (Bible Wheel), etc. This, too, makes sense, especially when one understands that the middle of the number "seven" is very often significant. (Note the use of seven in Genesis creation and in the end times in Revelation.) And Lamentations is at the center of the seven-fold division of the categories of our Canon. It was the first thing I thought to look for due to my knowledge of this re-occurring pattern in the bible, having studied it intensively for 20 years. The entire book of Lamentations is taylor made to the Bible Wheel, with Christ (Alpha) at the very center word and letter of the entire Canon! "I AM!" As in, I am that which was, is, and shall be!

I mean, wow! Only those who do not want to see cannot see His glory.

One does not have to look very hard to see the pattern of the beginning, middle, and end, coupled with the number seven and the letters of the alphabet! Moreover, just as "He is that is, and was, and shall be," is a Trinity, so the middle of the five aphabetic acrostic sections of Lamentations also happens to be in trinitarian groups of three --- three lines each starting with alpha (aleph), then three each starting with beta (beth), straight through to Omega (Tav in Hebrew), this middle acrostic being the third acrostic from the start or from the end of the book of Lamentations. Coincidence or design?

Note in the following that verse 4a refers to God the Father, verse 4b refers to God the Holy Spirit, and verse 5a to God the Son, that is, the Three in One. Then the declaration: "I AM Alpha" in Rev. 1:8, and compare that to the 'Alpha' of Lam. 3:1, the exact middle of the seven-fold section of our Canon of Scripture (Bible Wheel), which reads, "Aleph" (i.e., "Alpha"), "I AM the Man who has seen affliction..." Could it be any more obvious?

Rev 1:4 John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Grace to you and peace, from him who is and who was and who is to come; and from the seven Spirits that are before his throne;
Rev 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loveth us, and loosed us from our sins by his blood;
Rev 1:6 and he made us to be a kingdom, to be priests unto his God and Father; to him be the glory and the dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with the clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they that pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth shall mourn over him. Even so, Amen.
Rev 1:8 I am the Alpha and the Omega, saith the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.
Rev. 1:11a What thou seest, write in a book and send it to the seven churches:

I just went to the Bible Wheel site and was surprised to find that the author does not even talk about this (as far as I can tell). Perhaps he has not noticed. Anyone feel like sending him a link. I would love his interaction on this thread. I hope my initial criticisms of the Wheel do not offend him. I admit that I was too quick to cast it all aside because of what I still think is the stretching of things at many points when it comes to the linking of the spokes. Thanks for having the faith and nerve to publish your findings author of the Bible Wheel, even if there is stubble mixed in, which I know is the case with my own site too, so who am I to judge!

[Shekel]

I am putting this here again because I don't want it to be lost in the large previous post.

==========================

The fact that the book of Lamentations is often contested as to where it really belongs in the canon of Scripture as to its order only tells me that it is where it should be, a maverick book at the center of the seven-fold division of the Canon! We should expect that this middle book be somehow different, just as Genesis and Revelation are different in that each of these are obvious as to where they should, and have, gone in the Canon. Genesis is a book of beginnings, whereas Revelation is a book about the end! The beginning and the end of the Canon. Makes sense right? And the maverick Lamentations at the center, itself an acrostic with a center after the style of the whole Canon (Bible Wheel), etc. This, too, makes sense, especially when one understands that the middle of the number "seven" is very often significant. (Note the use of seven in Genesis creation and in the end times in Revelation.) And Lamentations is at the center of the seven-fold division of the categories of our Canon. It was the first thing I thought to look for due to my knowledge of this re-occurring pattern in the bible, having studied it intensively for 20 years. The entire book of Lamentations is taylor made to the Bible Wheel, with Christ (Alpha) at the very center word and letter of the entire Canon! "I AM!" As in, I am that which was, is, and shall be!

I mean, wow! Only those who do not want to see cannot see His glory.

One does not have to look very hard to see the pattern of the beginning, middle, and end, coupled with the number seven and the letters of the alphabet! Moreover, just as "He is that is, and was, and shall be," is a Trinity, so the middle of the five aphabetic acrostic sections of Lamentations also happens to be in trinitarian groups of three --- three lines each starting with alpha (aleph), then three each starting with beta (beth), straight through to Omega (Tav in Hebrew), this middle acrostic being the third acrostic from the start or from the end of the book of Lamentations. Coincidence or design?

Note in the following that verse 4a refers to God the Father, verse 4b refers to God the Holy Spirit, and verse 5a to God the Son, that is, the Three in One. Then the declaration: "I AM Alpha" in Rev. 1:8, and compare that to the 'Alpha' of Lam. 3:1, the exact middle of the seven-fold section of our Canon of Scripture (Bible Wheel), which reads, "Aleph" (i.e., "Alpha"), "I AM the Man who has seen affliction..." Could it be any more obvious?

Rev 1:4 John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Grace to you and peace, from him who is and who was and who is to come; and from the seven Spirits that are before his throne;
Rev 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loveth us, and loosed us from our sins by his blood;
Rev 1:6 and he made us to be a kingdom, to be priests unto his God and Father; to him be the glory and the dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with the clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they that pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth shall mourn over him. Even so, Amen.
Rev 1:8 I am the Alpha and the Omega, saith the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.
Rev. 1:11a What thou seest, write in a book and send it to the seven churches:

I just went to the Bible Wheel site and was surprised to find that the author does not even talk about this (as far as I can tell). Perhaps he has not noticed. Anyone feel like sending him a link. I would love his interaction on this thread. I hope my initial criticisms of the Wheel do not offend him. I admit that I was too quick to cast it all aside because of what I still think is the stretching of things at many points when it comes to the linking of the spokes. Thanks for having the faith and nerve to publish your findings author of the Bible Wheel, even if there is stubble mixed in, which I know is the case with my own site too, so who am I to judge!