[C]

This I found to be true: We as Christians actually have missing doctrine. Not only that, but we also have doctrine that are not Biblical . Many things have been absorbed and left out throughout this past 2000 years.

No offence, but a good example is the Catholic Church. A Catholic will tell you that all their doctrine is correct and they will defend it, so how do the Protestants differ? They also believe they are correct and will defend it. So it is fair to assume that there are things , even on the Protestant side that is incorrect. The same with the Charismatic and other movements. Little bits of truth everywhere and nobody with the whole picture. Everybody holding on to THEIR truth and defending it and throwing out all other.

So: What if we can look objectively at some things .

For instance, I see things differently and in another light, then others on this forum. I am still your brother in Christ although I differ. I come from another culture as most of you, another country, but I read the same Bible.

We have things like Baptism in the church that differ, some baptise infants.SOme do not. Some believe that you receive the Holy Spirit when you become a Christian , some say you have to pray for the Holy Spirit.
Some believe in the Rapture, some churches in my country have never heard of the rapture (pre-rapture)

Some preach prosperity and some say that is wrong, although they read the same Bible.Why? What motivates people to "screen out" certain truths?. Because that is exactly what we do: We read "in a certain light", we (humans) read things so that it will stabilise and strengthen our point of view and doctrine.


Question1 : Do you think it is possible to read only what is written and maybe break free from points of view that were given to us by men. Do you think it is possible to return, with the help of the Holy Spirit, to the Word as an ONLY source of information .That we again believe what we read. without that other "voice" (memory) of old doctrine, that may or may not have been tarnished by people over the last 2000 years?

Question 2 Do you think that it is possible that God has left some knowledge "locked" until the end of the age (the Last Days) and that, that knowledge is now coming to be known.
love C

This post has been edited by C: 23 July 2007 - 01:34 AM

[OneOfHisHandmaidens]

YES!!!!!!

and YES!!!!!

[C]

I agree.
I would like to know (but only if you want to ) Have you had some revelation yourself of some of the knowledge that is coming to the front in these times?
C

[Spirit Filled One]

On another thread, I was reading “the spirit of Jezebel” as being described by some on this forum and what their Idea of that is.

What I see happening in the church at large, (a very large portion of the church but not all) is that there has been A splicing of the things of the world and the traditions of men with the pure and holy Truth of the Word of God.

This is truly the Jezebel that is found in Rev. 2:20 and an answer to your question C. Yes, for sure God is revealing more of His hidden truth today than in the past 2000 years, but its only for those who have
“ears to hear” and “eyes to see”.

The Old Testament is in many ways a foreshadowing of these things to come and which have already come,
In Deuteronomy 10:17it says: For the LORD your God is God of gods and Lord of lords, the great God,
Also in Joshua 22:22:
“The LORD God of gods, the LORD God of gods, He knows, and let Israel itself know—if it is in rebellion

Finally, Psalm 95:3 For the LORD is the great God,And the great King above all gods.

In the New Testament, we are told that all dominion and power has been given to Jesus – Eph 1:19-22
And so now instead of using language that says He is “God of gods”, we now see that He is “King of kings”
(more on the King of kings in a moment)

You see, in the Old Testament, God knew that His people would have an understanding of what false “gods” were and He used that language in the scripture.
And today in the church, He is still speaking to His children in ways for us to hear, if we have ears to hear.

Ephesians 5
1 Therefore be imitators of God as dear children. 2 And walk in love, as Christ also has loved us and given Himself for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweet-smelling aroma.3 But fornication and all uncleanness or covetousness, let it not even be named among you, as is fitting for saints; 4 neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks. 5 For this you know, that no fornicator, unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. 6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience. 7 Therefore do not be partakers with them.

In verse 5, God is still concerned about idolatry and fornication, even among His children that have "accepted" Christ and are to be clean and unspotted from the world!
The idolatry is here now as well as the fornication. The fornication found in the church today is a spiritual fornication that Jesus speaks of in-
Revelation 2:20 Nevertheless I have a few things against you, because you allow that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess, to teach and seduce My servants to commit sexual immorality and eat things sacrificed to idols.

What kind of sexual immorality/fornication is this that Jesus is speaking of? What is it that is being eaten and how is it being sacrificed to idols?

It is a spiritual sexual immorality and an exchanging the Truth for a lie:
It is eating the flesh of another jesus and being satisfied with it instead of the Holy and Pure Word of God.
Galatians 1:8
But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.
This preaching another gospel is going on everywhere today, it is preached in the
Message that says, “pray this prayer and you will be saved” it is preached by compromising Gods holiness for us in becoming entangled in the things of the world or incorporating the world with a Holy and righteous God!
Here is one example: This past Sunday, our newly appointed youth pastor was to preach a message instead of the senior pastor, as he was on vacation. In one breath, the youth pastor was speaking about not being of the world and bringing the message of the gospel to the world, in another breath he made an announcement of an upcoming concert that he is part of (he plays the guitar) and that he wanted to warn everyone that the music was “hard christian rock”???? If you have any understanding of what he said, you would understand that it is very much like asking ozzie osborne or iron maiden to play their music but leave out their lyrics while you substitute them for a few references to salvation and the cross!

The whole reason for this kind of wicked music and even for more mainstream is solely to make the listener
“feel good” it is to please the flesh and nothing else!
Jesus told us to have no confidence in the flesh and in fact to put it to death daily by picking up our cross and following Him! Otherwise you are not His disciple (Luke 14:27)
When singing the praise music and hymns that we sing, are we concerned that it is glorifying and pleasing to God, or glorifying and pleasing to us??!!

Many have compromised Gods Truth and are bringing in a little leaven.

Yesterday, while visiting with some friends from our congregation, I voiced my concerns and this was the response “ We have to reach the lost on their terms and with what they will listen to”

Now, I’m not at all saying that this spirit of Jezebel is only found in this type of thing, but I am saying that the Holiness of God and the putting to death the flesh as well as many other foundational teachings of Christ
Have been altered in many ways by this Jezebel Spirit in the church.

Revelation 17:
9 “Here is the mind which has wisdom: The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits.
(there are 7 mountains in Jerusalem, Mt. Goath, Mt. Gareb, Mt. Acra, Mt. Bezetha, Mt. Zion, Mt. Ophel, and Mt. Moriah. these are a spiritual meaning of the 7 churches, just as the bride is described in Rev 21:2 as
the "New Jerusalem", the woman that sits there on these mountains is supposed to be a virgin that has kept herself pure and ready for the coming of her betrothed, but has become this Jezebel or this harlot)

10 There are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. And when he comes, he must continue a short time.
It speaks here of seven kings. In the beginning of the Revelation, Jesus is speaking to the seven churches but as His revelation unfolds,
He makes us that have ears to hear, understand that the churches are following the foreshadowing of Israel and going after other gods just as they did. The King of the church was Jesus and now they have set up and appointed their own “kings”, there are different christ's and gospel's than the one Truth given by Christ and His Apostles, it is a “king” and a “christ” that they follow after in the lust of their flesh and the imagination of their heart.
Just as God brought them out of Egypt to serve Him and they chose to serve another god by making an idol of gold and saying that it had brought them out of Egypt and out of bondage, today, they also set up a new king that they want to serve with the flesh in a way that pleases them and not in spirit and truth.

Revelation 17:14
14These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Jesus is letting us see here, just a few verses after 17:9 regarding the 7 false kings, that He is the true King above these kings.

Revelation 18
The Fall of Babylon the Great
1 After these things I saw another angel coming down from heaven, having great authority, and the earth was illuminated with his glory. 2 And he cried mightily with a loud voice, saying, “Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and has become a dwelling place of demons, a prison for every foul spirit, and a cage for every unclean and hated bird! 3 For all the nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth have become rich through the abundance of her luxury.”

In Rev 2:20The word Jezebel is described in the Greek as “dwelling place” or “habitation”

Babylon was not supposed to become Babylon, it was supposed to stay pure and clean as a virgin prepared for her betrothed, the church has become a “mystery” and defiled herself for the most part.

In the Old Testament, Jezebel stole the vinyard from Naboth the Jezreelite and today is trying to steal the vinyard from the children of God.

“He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death.”’

And he who overcomes, and keeps My works until the end, to him I will give power over the nations—

He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.

He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.

He who overcomes shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be My son.

Praises to the King of kings!!!

In Christ always,
Chris

This post has been edited by SpiritFilledOne: 23 July 2007 - 12:07 PM

[calvin]

Question 1. No ... I believe it would be next to impossible to erase the memory of our preconceptions.

Question 2. Yes

I believe God's sign in the net 153 in John 21:11 and why it was Peter that did the "counting" would be one example. Another would be God's "two witnesses" found in the Hebrew Bible of the "Shema". The first and great commandment to Jew and Gentile found in Deut 6:4

Hear O Israel The Lord Our God Is One

shemA Israel Jehovah Elohenu Jehovah echaD

Note the two extra large and dark letters. Only once does this occur in Torah where two of these mysterious large letters occur together. Together they form the literal meaning "witness", and they have lain there for 3 1/2 days since Moses was inspired to place them there ... ie 3 1/2 "prophetic days" ... 3500 years ago.
See Psalm 90 and Rev 11.

[C]

Thanks Chris, I enjoyed your post. Its well written and I agree. Thanks for all the scripture use, it is great to see a post with so much Word.

You have touched on many good points.

There are many traditions that blind the people of God today. Many teachings that we have accepted into our hearts, that were given to us by faithless "teachers" who explained away their own lack of faith, to congregations of ignorant people.
Ex: When nobody got healed after prayer, they invented: God always answers prayer with a "no" or a "yes". You are not healed because it is a "no". So people fell into a faithless tradition.

And:
When they saw that they were still sinning and did not overcome, they invented: "We are sinners saved by grace" . Today, people quote that as if it is in the Bible (and we attack the Catholics for believing the traditions of men ! )1Co 14:33 for God is not a God of confusion, but of peace. As in all the churches of the saints,

So we have two groups: the sinners saved by grace and the saints saved by grace. ...but one group is not in the Bible.


Something that liberated me was the knowledge that even though Jesus was the best teacher in the world, the disciples, after three years of this teaching and seeing Jesus do miracles,STILL did not have faith. So what makes it so hard for us to say: " I need more faith."
We can and must admit to a lack of faith, because that is what the problem is.But so many do not want to admit to that ! I have seen in my own life that , that is the case. Now I pray for faith and that God Himself must teach me. We are lost without the teaching of the Spirit.

So if anybody else can lift out some error (but please back it up with scripture)
C

This post has been edited by C: 23 July 2007 - 03:47 PM